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Post by mcbogga on Aug 3, 2016 17:47:30 GMT -5
Way too lenient, IMO.
This is clearly not a case where Tim and Doyley turning the other cheek is going to do anything other than get them another slap.
We have seen no signs that this guy acknowledges that he did something wrong. He clearly cheated yet withholds that he didn't. He does not seem to think coming back under another account was a problem either. And now you expect him to behave any better?
Also pretty much a slap in the face for Canuck who was physically threatened by the guy and anyone who has been suspended, taken their penalty quietly and come back clean. But if TGCT is fine with threats and repeated cheating and breach of fundamental community rules then so be it I guess.
And sorry - but that "this is an online community so it's all good" is completely wrong. That kind of thinking is exactly what turns the net into a sewer. Thought this place was just maybe a bit different.
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Post by nevadaballin on Aug 3, 2016 18:05:56 GMT -5
I have been to prison, so 2nd chances can be a good thing. but not everybody in prison did the same things: some did nothing more than steal a pack of gum, happen to be from a race that the locals have a hatred for, and toss him away for a long time some raped or killed other people, happen to be rich, hired a nice lawyer, and have just a little more time to serve than the guy above some commuted serious acts of thievery, such as embezzlement or fraud, got large stacks of cash, got caught and are doing about the same amount of time as the above two some got caught smoking dope, got a little bit of time some got caught pissing in public, got a little bit of time plus a sex offender status put on them some got caught drinking and driving, first time, got a little bit of time plus huge fine and court fees two sets of bad guys above, 3 got lots of time, 3 got little bits of time which ones would you be friends with after the fact? i committed burglary 18 years ago, did my time, and now i am squeaky clean, i even hate speeding, i just dont want to go back......ever. but this here is the internet, there are different crimes. so steve is guilty of: cheating, avoiding the original suspension, threats to your staff, and a whole lot of lying. its not my call, but at a minimum, your minimum seems too easy (tgc2 release), i feel that 1 year still needs to be upheld before any other thoughts are started. and retrospect that starting from the other day when you outed him publicly. that one year is for the masters cheating, i would then consider additional time for the threats and the suspension avoidance. but its not on me, im just giving my 2 cents. Interesting point. Never did serve the original sentence. The present one works out to about 6 months maybe. But it is mentioned that reconsideration in front of the parole board is not a guarantee. The addition that good behaviour/community service could influence a return was also interesting. We'll see how it goes. I do hope he makes it back at some point, I've always enjoyed his input. But the scales of justice must be blind and fair when it comes to crime and punishment.
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Post by SmilingGoats on Aug 3, 2016 18:41:41 GMT -5
Way too lenient, IMO. This is clearly not a case where Tim and Doyley turning the other cheek is going to do anything other than get them another slap. We have seen no signs that this guy acknowledges that he did something wrong. He clearly cheated yet withholds that he didn't. He does not seem to think coming back under another account was a problem either. And now you expect him to behave any better? Also pretty much a slap in the face for Canuck who was physically threatened by the guy and anyone who has been suspended, taken their penalty quietly and come back clean. But if TGCT is fine with threats and repeated cheating and breach of fundamental community rules then so be it I guess. And sorry - but that "this is an online community so it's all good" is completely wrong. That kind of thinking is exactly what turns the net into a sewer. Thought this place was just maybe a bit different. A couple of points of clarification: 1) His ban is indefinite. The only thing that would have been more harsh would have been to say his ban was permanent. Indefinite leaves us the option to reinstate him at a later time should we want. It gives us the option, but makes no promises. 2) He did apologize to Canuck in this post: tgctours.proboards.com/post/151670 And I'm pretty sure Andre doesn't feel our decision is a slap in the face. 3) The voting parties are Tim, Doyley, and me. Not just Tim and Doyley. The rest of the staff were able to offer opinions but any major decision pertaining to TGC Tours will always come down to the three site founders. I say that so that it is clear who is responsible for the decision.
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Post by splittailace on Aug 3, 2016 19:24:17 GMT -5
He told me I was poo on his shoe. Send him to the gallows.
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Post by Brighttail on Aug 3, 2016 19:54:29 GMT -5
Thank you for letting us know. Admins didn't have to do this but it is nice that it is out in the open.
To me the ban seems more than fair. It could have been more more lenient and it could have been more harsh, and it still is possible to be so. It is all now based on Steve himself. He knows what he needs to do to have a chance to come back and I too am rooting for him.
In the end no decision will satisfy everyone, but again, I hope that we can all respect the final decision of the three admins who made the final call. Agree or disagree to your heart's content, but it is done and we should accept the outcome with respect.
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Post by splittailace on Aug 3, 2016 20:15:55 GMT -5
I can't imagine him ever trying to come back after the amount of premeditated deception he put into this whole thing. Then actually being caught.
Hell, people dislike me cause I cause occasional grumblings. I can't imagine the pure hatred some may have towards this guy now. Craziness
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Post by owenayy on Aug 3, 2016 21:20:04 GMT -5
I don't know the guy, never had any interactions that I remember, but considering the circumstances, my Creep-O-Meter has pegged out at an absolute 10....
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Post by mcbogga on Aug 3, 2016 21:48:22 GMT -5
Way too lenient, IMO. This is clearly not a case where Tim and Doyley turning the other cheek is going to do anything other than get them another slap. We have seen no signs that this guy acknowledges that he did something wrong. He clearly cheated yet withholds that he didn't. He does not seem to think coming back under another account was a problem either. And now you expect him to behave any better? Also pretty much a slap in the face for Canuck who was physically threatened by the guy and anyone who has been suspended, taken their penalty quietly and come back clean. But if TGCT is fine with threats and repeated cheating and breach of fundamental community rules then so be it I guess. And sorry - but that "this is an online community so it's all good" is completely wrong. That kind of thinking is exactly what turns the net into a sewer. Thought this place was just maybe a bit different. A couple of points of clarification: 1) His ban is indefinite. The only thing that would have been more harsh would have been to say his ban was permanent. Indefinite leaves us the option to reinstate him at a later time should we want. It gives us the option, but makes no promises. 2) He did apologize to Canuck in this post: tgctours.proboards.com/post/151670 And I'm pretty sure Andre doesn't feel our decision is a slap in the face. 3) The voting parties are Tim, Doyley, and me. Not just Tim and Doyley. The rest of the staff were able to offer opinions but any major decision pertaining to TGC Tours will always come down to the three site founders. I say that so that it is clear who is responsible for the decision. Sorry for leaving you out - goats.
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Post by blackaces13 on Aug 4, 2016 6:23:49 GMT -5
What's the word on his wins being vacated? I haven't looked into it but a few people mentioned that myself and James Morgan came in 2nd for a couple of his wins.
I understand that retroactively calculating WGR, $, etc. is infeasible, but should I make room on my shelf for more hardware?
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Post by SmilingGoats on Aug 4, 2016 6:52:48 GMT -5
We have voted to leave things as they are because of the hassle involved and the fact that it opens up several cans of worms.
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Post by ABU_Bear on Aug 4, 2016 7:10:08 GMT -5
can you at least remove his name from scrolling across the banner. It may just be me but I think it kinda gives the forum a black eye
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Post by SmilingGoats on Aug 4, 2016 7:32:50 GMT -5
can you at least remove his name from scrolling across the banner. It may just be me but I think it kinda gives the forum a black eye Yeah I have to talk to Tim about that. Unfortunately, Tim is super busy. We have deactivated the Bryan Boomer account on the site, but deleting it gets to be tricky because it could throw off the calculations of well, basically everything. So we'll discuss it further. This was a particularly bad time for this to occur (as if there would ever be a good time).
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Post by Morgan-esque on Aug 4, 2016 8:15:47 GMT -5
We have voted to leave things as they are because of the hassle involved and the fact that it opens up several cans of worms. I must say I'm disappointed in this. Appreciate it is a pain, but his results should now be null and void. We've been beaten my someone who wasn't supposed to be there. Not only that, but for me I was desperate for that win, something that I had to wait an extra long time to get because of this. So I think it'd be appreciated if you could add it to a list of things to revisit at some point.
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Post by SweetTeeBag on Aug 4, 2016 8:18:16 GMT -5
We have voted to leave things as they are because of the hassle involved and the fact that it opens up several cans of worms. I must say I'm disappointed in this. Appreciate it is a pain, but his results should now be null and void. We've been beaten my someone who wasn't supposed to be there. Not only that, but for me I was desperate for that win, something that I had to wait an extra long time to get because of this. So I think it'd be appreciated if you could add it to a list of things to revisit at some point. I agree with you James. Not sure how difficult it is to just take the trophy cards away and put them on Mike's and your page. If they have to leave the standings page alone so be it.
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Post by unclefester75 on Aug 4, 2016 8:28:41 GMT -5
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