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Post by paddyjk19 on Nov 9, 2022 12:06:27 GMT -5
My point was that it’s best for a course to be playable for ALL balls which gives the player the choice of what they want to use. If you set greens to 190+ the only ball that will be used is legendary friction and aviator. It would just become the norm and boring. At least with a 155 speed, it’s fast on default, it’s slower with friction and aviator but can also be used by magnet etc too. Offers a lot more variability compared to the super high speed greens. Plus if we have new players joining who are low on VC / balls, imagine if their first experience is 196 green and not being able to stay on the green whilst they’re already learning how to no grid golf. Would be pretty off putting! Just my two cents I agree, if there were 190+ each week, that would be boring, if majors go 190+ and people have to actually make a gameplay choice of friction or aviator or whatever - I think that's interesting - given the mechanics available. That would make a considerable difference in the setups playing that week. I'd certainly consider playing as different ball if conditions dictated I could score better with it. If we set for 155 speed each week, that in itself becomes realy boring IMO... I mean, I prefer the greens at >155 pace, but using an aviator (as the distance is beneficial) I have to make a small sacrifice as to putting at a slower speed that I find optimal. If we go to much lower speeds I'd have to think about changing balls. 119s etc are bloody horrible, to me. Personally, I don't want to be tied to 155 or lower greens, just because anything higher doesn't suit the worst ball available when there are good options there. I agree with that, it’s why I publish my greens at default 145 if super sloped (I.e. West Hill) but if a course has benign greens I go for 170. When you thrown in moderate 134, Fast 155 and VF 182 it gives you loads of options. Variety is key and I’m always happy to see it vary. In our sim society we often bounce between rainy (soft 134), medium firmness 145, firm 155-170 often at in the same tournament for a bit of realism. Got absolutely no issue with seeing a wide range of speeds and challenges |
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Post by fadgewacker on Nov 9, 2022 12:12:31 GMT -5
Anyhow - back to the golf.
Played very, very well in R4, but dropped 3 shots, when I 3 stabbed from about 6 feet - 3 times, when it was far easier to make a birdie... so closed with 5 under 67 for -21 total. Should have been 6 strokes better off!!!
Looking forward to next week.
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Post by beef on Nov 9, 2022 13:10:03 GMT -5
+2, +1, -4, +2 for a +1 total. Made a mess of the back 9 in Rd 4, 2 four stabs and a 3 putt lost me 5 strokes. Was glad to get at least 1 round under par though. Something to work with anyway and I'm going to try and play as much TST as I can this season.
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Post by beef on Nov 9, 2022 13:42:24 GMT -5
In terms of the balls, I think having different balls is a good thing, but like a few things in this series, they've probably not been implemented properly, or by someone who has a good level of knowledge about golf. Having options to increase distance or spin is pretty cool, balls changing firm and fast links courses into soft and slow ones is just silly.
The default ball should be the 'balanced' ball option. It's clearly not, it's shite. If they're determined to make us spend our credits earned on sleeves of balls then fine, make a balanced default ball a mid range price. The higher ranges of Aviators seem overpowered. My guess is that 90% of players will use these 90% of the time.
It is what it is though, they may tweak it but I'm not going to hold my breath.
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Post by InsanericK on Nov 9, 2022 14:48:49 GMT -5
 Joking aside mate, I've said from the start the balls are silly - happy to have one with better flight stats, one with better spin stats etc, but the changing of the green speeds is ridiculous... Unfortunately, unless you want to give up 17 yds off the tee, we are where we are for now. Slowing greens down is silly, so is making greens softer. It just manipulating the course conditions. It is getting a little silly and very arcade, this should be discussed as it is a sim tour. I have no interest in any other tour here on TGCTOURS. Where we are now on TST is 18 under rounds with the longest holed putt 12 foot. There is no tough set up anymore when a golf ball dictates how a course plays, it's beyond silly. Was actually pumped up for TST this season as the set up by the admins is excellent, couldn't get on with pro difficulty last season but I liked the jump back to master. Slowing down the green is silly. Cutting wind is silly. I have only one question. When you saw there would be 20 nee balls in this game, what were you expecting? Did you expect that some balls would act differently than others? Did you expect all balls would travel the same distance? |
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Post by sroel908 on Nov 9, 2022 15:03:31 GMT -5
Slowing greens down is silly, so is making greens softer. It just manipulating the course conditions. It is getting a little silly and very arcade, this should be discussed as it is a sim tour. I have no interest in any other tour here on TGCTOURS. Where we are now on TST is 18 under rounds with the longest holed putt 12 foot. There is no tough set up anymore when a golf ball dictates how a course plays, it's beyond silly. Was actually pumped up for TST this season as the set up by the admins is excellent, couldn't get on with pro difficulty last season but I liked the jump back to master. Slowing down the green is silly. Cutting wind is silly. I have only one question. When you saw there would be 20 nee balls in this game, what were you expecting? Did you expect that some balls would act differently than others? Did you expect all balls would travel the same distance? Sorry to jump in here, as I don't play TST, but these consumable golf balls seem to take over any and all discussion on these boards. I think my response to your question would be that, yes, I expected the golf balls to have attributes and perform differently. But NO ONE expected them to literally change the speeds of the greens, or essentially alter the firmness of the turf or change how wind affects flight. I was anticipating having a golf ball that would maybe offer more spin at a cost of distance, or there'd be one that would offer more distance but have a bit less spin...things like that. I never once expected there to be a golf ball offered in an HB "simulation" golf game that would flat-out alter course conditions, making a course play differently for one person vs. another - simply based on what golf ball they used. And this is especially true when all the info given to the content creators who did the preview discussions/videos was that the golf balls were no big deal and didn't really make that much of a difference. Instead, you can pick a golf ball that immediately gives you 20 yards of distance, while slowing down the greens a significant amount. That was not at all expected...as evidenced by the reactions from the 2K NextMakers and the admins here at TGCT. All that said...these golf balls are part of the game, and likely won't be locked out from use in Societies. So they are what they are. We might bemoan their inclusion, but they won't be going away. And neither will the default ball, so all options must be taken into consideration when choosing courses and putting together event setups. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 9, 2022 15:27:39 GMT -5
Slowing greens down is silly, so is making greens softer. It just manipulating the course conditions. It is getting a little silly and very arcade, this should be discussed as it is a sim tour. I have no interest in any other tour here on TGCTOURS. Where we are now on TST is 18 under rounds with the longest holed putt 12 foot. There is no tough set up anymore when a golf ball dictates how a course plays, it's beyond silly. Was actually pumped up for TST this season as the set up by the admins is excellent, couldn't get on with pro difficulty last season but I liked the jump back to master. Slowing down the green is silly. Cutting wind is silly. I have only one question. When you saw there would be 20 nee balls in this game, what were you expecting? Did you expect that some balls would act differently than others? Did you expect all balls would travel the same distance? What that's suppose to mean. I expected different balls to have slightly different attributes to spin and distance not actually change course conditions, who on earth expect ed that. I certainly didn't think we would have such arcade balls and don't kid yourself this is Mario Golf arcade nonsense in the extreme. Gone is a great part of the game of setting up tournaments realistically. You have a sim tour here that can't even have that very firm set up in the Open on a Sunday as a magic ball can soften the course right up, Augusta greens can be slowed right down so that's out the window also. What is the point of Frans and his team setting up any tournament when an arcade ball in the game can slow those greens down significantly. We might as all be playing different courses as conditions change a course difficulty so much. I have never seen 2K mention arcade in any promotional videos but they do mention simulation a lot. I might get a mocking meme from someone here when I mentioned that my society will be testing greens and everyone playing the same ball so everyone plays the same course conditions. But you know what, all playing the same course set up is fun, much more fun than this 2K sh%$ show. I haven't got a clue what the top scores here course conditions are being played. Everyone is just playing a different setup and why would I even bother spending time with that. TGCTours went pro to even the field a bit cross platform, these balls have divided the field more than it's ever been. |
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Post by InsanericK on Nov 9, 2022 15:28:39 GMT -5
Slowing down the green is silly. Cutting wind is silly. I have only one question. When you saw there would be 20 nee balls in this game, what were you expecting? Did you expect that some balls would act differently than others? Did you expect all balls would travel the same distance? Sorry to jump in here, as I don't play TST, but these consumable golf balls seem to take over any and all discussion on these boards. I think my response to your question would be that, yes, I expected the golf balls to have attributes and perform differently. But NO ONE expected them to literally change the speeds of the greens, or essentially alter the firmness of the turf or change how wind affects flight. I was anticipating having a golf ball that would maybe offer more spin at a cost of distance, or there'd be one that would offer more distance but have a bit less spin...things like that. I never once expected there to be a golf ball offered in an HB "simulation" golf game that would flat-out alter course conditions, making a course play differently for one person vs. another - simply based on what golf ball they used. And this is especially true when all the info given to the content creators who did the preview discussions/videos was that the golf balls were no big deal and didn't really make that much of a difference. Instead, you can pick a golf ball that immediately gives you 20 yards of distance, while slowing down the greens a significant amount. That was not at all expected...as evidenced by the reactions from the 2K NextMakers and the admins here at TGCT. All that said...these golf balls are part of the game, and likely won't be locked out from use in Societies. So they are what they are. We might bemoan their inclusion, but they won't be going away. And neither will the default ball, so all options must be taken into consideration when choosing courses and putting together event setups. Thanks for that beautiful anwser. That's exaclty what I wanted to read. Now give me 2 hours and I'll anwser you. I'll wait to be at the job and steal time there! 😅 |
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Post by sroel908 on Nov 9, 2022 15:32:10 GMT -5
Sorry to jump in here, as I don't play TST, but these consumable golf balls seem to take over any and all discussion on these boards. I think my response to your question would be that, yes, I expected the golf balls to have attributes and perform differently. But NO ONE expected them to literally change the speeds of the greens, or essentially alter the firmness of the turf or change how wind affects flight. I was anticipating having a golf ball that would maybe offer more spin at a cost of distance, or there'd be one that would offer more distance but have a bit less spin...things like that. I never once expected there to be a golf ball offered in an HB "simulation" golf game that would flat-out alter course conditions, making a course play differently for one person vs. another - simply based on what golf ball they used. And this is especially true when all the info given to the content creators who did the preview discussions/videos was that the golf balls were no big deal and didn't really make that much of a difference. Instead, you can pick a golf ball that immediately gives you 20 yards of distance, while slowing down the greens a significant amount. That was not at all expected...as evidenced by the reactions from the 2K NextMakers and the admins here at TGCT. All that said...these golf balls are part of the game, and likely won't be locked out from use in Societies. So they are what they are. We might bemoan their inclusion, but they won't be going away. And neither will the default ball, so all options must be taken into consideration when choosing courses and putting together event setups. Thanks for that beautiful anwser. That's exaclty what I wanted to read. Now give me 2 hours and I'll anwser you. I'll wait to be at the job and steal time there! 😅 Boss makes a dollar I make a dime That's why I post On company time :-) |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 9, 2022 15:33:50 GMT -5
Slowing down the green is silly. Cutting wind is silly. I have only one question. When you saw there would be 20 nee balls in this game, what were you expecting? Did you expect that some balls would act differently than others? Did you expect all balls would travel the same distance? Sorry to jump in here, as I don't play TST, but these consumable golf balls seem to take over any and all discussion on these boards. I think my response to your question would be that, yes, I expected the golf balls to have attributes and perform differently. But NO ONE expected them to literally change the speeds of the greens, or essentially alter the firmness of the turf or change how wind affects flight. I was anticipating having a golf ball that would maybe offer more spin at a cost of distance, or there'd be one that would offer more distance but have a bit less spin...things like that. I never once expected there to be a golf ball offered in an HB "simulation" golf game that would flat-out alter course conditions, making a course play differently for one person vs. another - simply based on what golf ball they used. And this is especially true when all the info given to the content creators who did the preview discussions/videos was that the golf balls were no big deal and didn't really make that much of a difference. Instead, you can pick a golf ball that immediately gives you 20 yards of distance, while slowing down the greens a significant amount. That was not at all expected...as evidenced by the reactions from the 2K NextMakers and the admins here at TGCT. All that said...these golf balls are part of the game, and likely won't be locked out from use in Societies. So they are what they are. We might bemoan their inclusion, but they won't be going away. And neither will the default ball, so all options must be taken into consideration when choosing courses and putting together event setups. I just read you post after I posted mine. You are on the exact same wavelength as me here. And this does apply to other tours and societies. It is.such a crap thing to introduce to the game and it is for one sole purpose. Up there with that loot box shenanigans. |
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Post by fransslabak on Nov 9, 2022 15:44:47 GMT -5
Thanks all for the discussion - be nice to each other in the remainder of it, please... just so that your scheduler can keep learning from it!  My take on it is simple: no point in discussing whether it's wrong that there are different balls; they are part of the game and we'll have to deal with them. Some will like them, some will hate them. But, unless we hear otherwise, we have to assume they are here to stay (and, as explained by quite a few on these forums already, we'll be able to "pay" for them by simply playing the game once we have all advanced to higher levels and fitted our clubs). As a scheduler, for now, I'll try to keep things playable with different balls BUT I suspect there will come a time - maybe even sooner rather than later - that I'll be forced to make a decision on (1) including a great RCR of a top IRL course played that week on the IRL PGA but accepting that it can only be played in "normal conditions" with specific ball types OR (2) dumb down the greens to butter OR (3) not use the RCR at all. You tell me what you think I should do... |
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Post by paddyjk19 on Nov 9, 2022 16:01:38 GMT -5
Thanks all for the discussion - be nice to each other in the remainder of it, please... just so that your scheduler can keep learning from it! My take on it is simple: no point in discussing whether it's wrong that there are different balls; they are part of the game and we'll have to deal with them. Some will like them, some will hate them. But, unless we hear otherwise, we have to assume they are here to stay (and, as explained by quite a few on these forums already, we'll be able to "pay" for them by simply playing the game once we have all advanced to higher levels and fitted our clubs). As a scheduler, for now, I'll try to keep things playable with different balls BUT I suspect there will come a time - maybe even sooner rather than later - that I'll be forced to make a decision on (1) including a great RCR of a top IRL course played that week on the IRL PGA but accepting that it can only be played in "normal conditions" with specific ball types OR (2) dumb down the greens to butter OR (3) not use the RCR at all. You tell me what you think I should do... You should always use the RCR IMO. The quality of the courses we play is of utmost importance. As the scheduler you’ll probably have to use a blend on all of the above, if it’s a short course you’ll probably have to trick it up (if the greens are balanced), if it’s a brutal shot making course you can probably leave at 155 and if the greens are mental you can probably slow them up a bit but use wind to challenge the other aspect. You know what you’re doing Frans and I’m sure we all have confidence you’ll get it right! Just keep picking the best recreations as a starting point! |
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Post by InsanericK on Nov 9, 2022 17:43:52 GMT -5
Slowing down the green is silly. Cutting wind is silly. I have only one question. When you saw there would be 20 nee balls in this game, what were you expecting? Did you expect that some balls would act differently than others? Did you expect all balls would travel the same distance? What that's suppose to mean. I expected different balls to have slightly different attributes to spin and distance not actually change course conditions, who on earth expect ed that. I certainly didn't think we would have such arcade balls and don't kid yourself this is Mario Golf arcade nonsense in the extreme. Gone is a great part of the game of setting up tournaments realistically. You have a sim tour here that can't even have that very firm set up in the Open on a Sunday as a magic ball can soften the course right up, Augusta greens can be slowed right down so that's out the window also. What is the point of Frans and his team setting up any tournament when an arcade ball in the game can slow those greens down significantly. We might as all be playing different courses as conditions change a course difficulty so much. I have never seen 2K mention arcade in any promotional videos but they do mention simulation a lot. I might get a mocking meme from someone here when I mentioned that my society will be testing greens and everyone playing the same ball so everyone plays the same course conditions. But you know what, all playing the same course set up is fun, much more fun than this 2K sh%$ show. I haven't got a clue what the top scores here course conditions are being played. Everyone is just playing a different setup and why would I even bother spending time with that. TGCTours went pro to even the field a bit cross platform, these balls have divided the field more than it's ever been. . I'll anwser him, but it's you too at the same time. Just like him, you don't see the equivalance principle. Well I'm not surprised you don't know where I'm going with that simple question. It's exaclty the reason you don't get the balls and more important, you don't get what the default ball is. So you acknowledge and expected consumable balls to be better than default. That's a great start Cause that's what video games do. In a shooter game, the first free gun they give you isn't the best. In an RPG game, the first sword and shield they give you arent the best ones. In a racing game, the first default car they give is a crappy one and you will either upgrade your car, or buy a new one that goes faster. So here's what your expectations were. Let's just focus on the green speed, but same logic apply to all aspects of the balls: Default ball: very fast greens of 187 Legendary ball: very fast greens of 187 Damn, look at this!! It's like they are the same balls! But as you have already acknowledged, you still expect the legendary ball to be better. So to clarify your expectations, here they are again: Default ball: very fast greens of 187 Legendary ball: Player would SEE 187 greens on their screen, but this would FEEL like 163 since the legendary ball would make less roling with the same shot/putt. It has the be better somehow. Here's the reality: Default ball: very fast green of 187. Legendary ball: same sh%$ than default ball, this is the same ball, but turns 187 greens into 163 greens. There's no difference. You're fighting against the general relativity of Einstein if you tell me the legendary ball acts differently between your expectations and reality here. Doesn't change anything that the green speed change from 187 to 163 than having the ball roll slower on the same 187 greens and thus would FEEL like 163. You just dont see the equivalance principle here. If 2K made a racing game with the same mindset, buying new parts for your car would not make your car going faster. This would change the track for you. And the results, again, would be the same damn thing. A better track would make your max speed better, without giving you a best motor. You could not tell the difference between a motor upgrading max speed from 250 to 275 than a better track under your car allowing your shitty car to have a max speed of 275 instead of 250. Equivalance principle again, good luck arguing against this. And you all wrong again with the default ball being unplayable on very fast greens. There's 21 balls in this game, they all have different attributes. Default ball is just 1 out of 21 and default ball have very specific skills like the other 20 balls. Default ball is not special. They are all playable on very fast greens, if you know your ball and adjust your game to it. Magnetic ball that has rolling higher than defaut ball are modifying the conditions too by turning the greens faster than default ball. So don't come here telling us it's unplayable at 187 when you choose to pick one the most extreme rolling ball, with a big bounce and very few spin. Ajust your game then! If you have to shoot at 170y on a 235y Par 3 cause you picked a ball who refuse to stop, then do it. Oh... it's now very unrealistic huh!? Well again, your choice to play with the crappy free ball they gave you at the begining of the game! |
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Post by Tombanator on Nov 9, 2022 19:10:44 GMT -5
Well, here we go again I guess! For better or worse, based on the discussion on here... I don't know. I don't personally care. Started this season off with a -6, -2 for -8 after 2 rounds. Was rolling along quite nicely in round 1, one measly bunker came along to mess me up a little with a double bogey but other than that, I was scoring on a pretty respectable pace. Had to wait for my welcome to this season of TST a little bit, but eventually found it by stupidly going for it on 18 and getting left with a 67 footer with 3 feet of uphill... oops. How did I only take 3 putts is a mystery that I'd rather not solve. Round 2 was more boring, thanks to tempo gremlins hitting me hard (new season, new game, new stuff... some things still the same!) but kept the score adjusting mistakes to just 2 holes while having to putt from tough distances thanks to being off on shots. Won't blame anything but myself on that. Haven't grinded it out nearly as much as some others so my expectations were kinda low or none on my end, but I can take this start! Oh, and I'm still on the default ball... because I'm not bothered to switch to any others. Maybe I'm making my game harder thanks to that, but whatever. It's how I like to play, much like I'm sure others like to play with certain consumables and those only. I'm not going to go into any of this debate going on, use whatever balls you want. I'm out here using the free ball and being a stingy bugger, hopefully my method and choice of play won't come to an almost forced stop by any means, but I'm prepared for that at some point down the line. I personally liked this course on offer this week, I'm having a lot of fun on it for a nice, cozy season opener. Bit of a shame that there's another season, a new game and a new debate/argument to be had... again, but at this point, the water is wet and all that. I'd rather stay out of this whole discussion, certainly one to be had but my input on the matter won't add much to it, if any at all. I'm just going to say that I trust the decisions made going forward, and if I must adjust accordingly, then I will. I've got all the confidence in the world that the decisions and choices made going down the line will turn out alright and we can all continue to enjoy our little golf games. Cheers, and best of luck this season! Hope we all have a good one.  |
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Post by Smijti on Nov 9, 2022 19:12:46 GMT -5
It's not pay to win lads... I think we can agree that you need to pay VC to get consumable balls, because that is a fact. I think we can also agree that certain balls will make the game easier for you in certain conditions, because that is a fact. So you pay for something which gives you an advantage. Well, per definition, that is pay to win. And yeah, doesn't hurt people that much when they've got coins to spare - same applies with real money. The amount you've got to spare doesn't change the purpose, it only changes the willingness to invest. That is pay to win 101. It's no rocket science and sadly it's no surprise as 2k is involved. You can sugarcoat it all you want, but it doesn't change the facts. |
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