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Post by nevadaballin on Mar 2, 2015 4:29:40 GMT -5
I really hope they make that grid an option in that case and that TGCT does not implement. I hope they do implement. It could level the playing field more without having to really do anything. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 2, 2015 4:43:04 GMT -5
How would that level the playing field?
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Post by nevadaballin on Mar 2, 2015 5:01:12 GMT -5
How would that level the playing field? Players who are struggling right now may improve because they are misinterpreting the ball lie. i didn't say it was a guaranteed leveling, just a "might".... and for some, not all. People like me are beyond all help lol |
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Post by mcbogga on Mar 2, 2015 9:45:16 GMT -5
And the next question - why would anyone want to level the playing field / make the game easier? I think we have problems in the opposite direction and we need some added complexity to keep the leader-board separated...
Back on topic - There seems to be a bug here that affects some more than others - this should be fixed as right now it seems the competition is not fair.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 2, 2015 10:09:45 GMT -5
And the next question - why would anyone want to level the playing field / make the game easier? I think we have problems in the opposite direction and we need some added complexity to keep the leader-board separated... Back on topic - There seems to be a bug here that affects some more than others - this should be fixed as right now it seems the competition is not fair. Been saying the exact thing for 2 months now. Have sortof no issue with the ball coming off random if it effected everyone equally. Reason I say sort-of, well I'm just not the lucky sort, I have won 1 draw in my life and it was an elimination draw, last 1 out of the hat, and I won a capon. So when I see luck, I usually cringe.
I believe the absolute best solution is to bring in uneven lies, and not the haphazard version they have now, but true uneven lies, have the ball react true to the lie and the axis hit, not some random mishmash we have now, also uphill and downhill as well.
I always believe in may the better person win on an even playing field, the win is much tastier then.
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Post by shoey101 on Mar 2, 2015 10:26:24 GMT -5
I play on the ps4 and have started noticing it more over the last week or so. Happens on almost every par 3 it seems which makes them tough to birdie. I usually shoot in low 60s. It probably happens 5-10 times a round
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Post by Pubknight on Mar 2, 2015 11:09:34 GMT -5
I have a different take on this that might not be popular, as I don't think ball squirt is an issue.
I think backswings that are either a little inside or a little outside can cause some push/pull, so the player might get some unanticipated results.
I also think 'ball squirt' in general is misinterpreted due to graphic presentation.
Allow me to explain that:
I think the ball ends up where it is supposed to, taking the swing/lie/wind into account.
However, the curvature of the ball in flight is not accurately represented in situations where there are multiple factors at play.
Say a left to right wind for example with a ball above your feet lie (right handed golfer)
You play a little draw to offset the wind, but perhaps not enough to fully offset it, because of the uphill lie pull factor.
What you would expect to see is a ball that starts straight, perhaps a little right to left, but falls off to the right in it's descent, as the wind overpowers the draw.
But what you actually see on screen is the net effect of all the factors: the ball starts to the right immediately.
The ball still lands where it is supposed to land, taking all things into account.
However the 'ball tracer' image does not match the path of the ball that we anticipate.
And we interpret that as ball squirt.
But the final result is the exact same.
In real life, I have hit many many shots that have 'S' curves.
A draw into a left to right wind for example.
The shot starts to curve to the left, then the draw flattens out, and then the ball falls off to the right.
I have never seen a Golf Club shot with more than one curvature path on the tracing arc.
Which leads me to conclude the tracing arc represents the 'net result' of all factors.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 2, 2015 11:20:06 GMT -5
I see what you think, but I use ball-cam, and I definately see some s-curves. I mainly use fade/draw to correct for wind, and when I hit it, it startes on the fade, then the wind will affect it at the end of the ball-flight.
But I see what you think. The problem is that often, on flat lies, the ball just jump-starts way left (in my case) of the intended line. Maybe it has to do with the back-swing (mouse back swing) but if that is the case, why the h*ll cant TGCG just say so??
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Post by Pubknight on Mar 2, 2015 11:50:24 GMT -5
I think they have: www.hb-studios.com/forum/index.php?topic=9139.msg96140#msg96140... And yes the direction of the backswing does effect trajectory. Currently a left to right swing sends the ball right and a right to left sends the ball left. We will, however, be adding a toggle so that can be switched so that folks who want a more realistic representation of a real golf-swing can set it so an in-to-out analog stick swing path will result in a draw and out-to-in will result in a fade. I think (but am not promising) that will be in the update in a few weeks. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 2, 2015 11:58:11 GMT -5
Pub, I was typing a long reply, but decided against it. So much of what you are saying is a mile off when it comes to this game. I'm not sure how much time you have spent studying the game and figuring it out, but making RL comparisons to this game is setting up yourself to never succeed in the game. RL has physics, the magnus effect etc etc. The game does well to mimic much of this, but falls short in many areas. What we are seeing is the net effect? Seriously. And you believe this why? Explain below then.    You know many games suffer from the community effect. People rapidly jumping to the defense of a game no matter what the issue. WGT is going to die a slow death because of that very thing. I would like to see the game improve and be closer to RL then it is. This is a major flaw in the game, this needs fixed, or implemented across the board. Either way, status quo is not an option and will eventually kill this game. Needing to defend the existence of a clear problem, identified by many, for months, is killing the ability to get it fixed. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 2, 2015 12:03:18 GMT -5
I have a different take on this that might not be popular, as I don't think ball squirt is an issue. I think backswings that are either a little inside or a little outside can cause some push/pull, so the player might get some unanticipated results. I also think 'ball squirt' in general is misinterpreted due to graphic presentation. lets debunk that theory right now. backswing is not the cause of the ball squirt. ill repeat, backswing is not the cause of ball squirt. brightail enabled his angle snapping on his mouse and tested it out, thus an effective strait shooter in non tourny rounds testing, and was still getting the ball squirt. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 2, 2015 12:04:54 GMT -5
And by the way, what if I showed you worse results from an even tee box lie with no wind and dead straight axis hit, would that help convince you of the existence of a problem? And by the way the above may not look like much, but its 60 feet of dispersion.
Further I could also show you the opposite, no dispersion with dead straight axis hit or way off axis hit. |
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Post by Pubknight on Mar 2, 2015 12:18:17 GMT -5
Pub, I was typing a long reply, but decided against it. So much of what you are saying is a mile off when it comes to this game. I'm not sure how much time you have spent studying the game and figuring it out, but making RL comparisons to this game is setting up yourself to never succeed in the game. RL has physics, the magnus effect etc etc. The game does well to mimic much of this, but falls short in many areas. What we are seeing is the net effect? Seriously. And you believe this why? Explain below then. Took the pictures out for space reasons. I recall reading (maybe it was tastegw?) that tee boxes are special places, and even an uneven tee box (like you pictured) is treated as a flat lie by the game engine. I can't prove or disprove that, but for the sake of discussion, let's say that's true. So in all your pictures, the starting lie is flat. (that's obviously a key assumption I'm making, and HB would need to confirm that) In all three pictures you have a slight push fade downswing, which one would anticipate to start left, and fade left. I can't see your backswing path obviously. But in all three of those pictures, again, assuming tee boxes are always treated as 'flat', I don't see any problem with any of those three ball launches. In fact, they are exactly what I would expect to see to be completely honest, with the winds displayed, were they hit off a flat tee box. I think what you have done with the severe tee box tilt, is effectively create an optical illusion. |
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Post by Pubknight on Mar 2, 2015 12:24:51 GMT -5
]lets debunk that theory right now. backswing is not the cause of the ball squirt. ill repeat, backswing is not the cause of ball squirt. brightail enabled his angle snapping on his mouse and tested it out, thus an effective strait shooter in non tourny rounds testing, and was still getting the ball squirt. HB has said backswing path affects ball flight direction. So, that part is not a theory. As for brightail's example, I would be curious to see what wind he had. A straight shooter swing with a sidewind that had the ball tracer starting to the side the wind was pushing, I would think would back up my notion that what is being represented is the net effect... don't you? |
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Post by mnguy12000 on Mar 2, 2015 12:34:09 GMT -5
I can't see a grid helping to be honest as the ball definetly goes the opposite way from your lie sometimes. The physics are not true to the lie for certain. A green grid would at least prove were not all mad in thinking this. 2nd this happened to me a bunch of times on the web tour event. #10 it happened every time in my rounds on my second shot. Ball below my feet yet goes to the left on a straight shot. It also happend on a few of the shot approach shots, cant remember the hole but was on the front and had a 9 iron and slope was above my feet and the ball went to the right. Cost me a bogey. as for what pubnight is saying i tend to agree with that, but the physics are still a little wonky with side hill lies. they need to correct it to make sure that the shots goes where it should. You have to make a good awful swing in RL to send the ball left on a lie that is below your feet. I feel when I am making a good swing based on the feedback it should go the right direction, regardless of how my backswing started, because it is the DOWNSWING, that send the ball in the direction it goes. |
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