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Post by theclv24 on Jan 27, 2018 22:47:56 GMT -5
It's been awhile since I've done a WIP thread, but I think this one could be interesting. I like to keep a fictional course in progress while I work on an RCR, and I've started and trashed a few projects before settling on this one. The Plot:The first premise of this project involves me purchasing the course that I more or less grew up on, and played in high school almost everyday on the golf team. The important thing to know about this course is that it sucks. It's 27 holes, which all together barely add up to 7000 yards, and they all suck. The plot is nearly dead flat, and every single green tilts straight back to front. The only feature of note is a ditch that cuts through the course, and it's extremely poorly utilized. There are also man-made water hazards throughout the course, and they are gross. The sign for the course advertises 3 things: golf, food, and liquor. Even the people who play the course, which is called Twin Oaks, affectionately refer to it as Twin Jokes. Before early access became available for TGC1, I had the idea for fictionally buying this course and turning it into 18 holes. I was working in Links 2003 at the moment, and I routed this course: Part 2:Rather than simply trying my hand at this project again in TGC2 rather than Links, I have decided to combine it with another project that I have been dabbling in, which is attempting a MacDonald/Raynor style course full of template holes. I experimented with a few holes on the Ross CC project, and if I remember correctly I think you can still see them in the published version around the perimeter. Now I am by no means an expert in template holes, and I'll probably get them wrong, but I enjoy the look. It also solves a crucial problem with the plot, which is, how do you make a flat plot interesting? If template holes worked for MacDonald at Chicago Golf Club, it should work perfectly fine here. Routing- After spending some time with this plot again, I realized that the ditch actually presents several routing problems, making it hard to fit 18 in here. I took a second look at my routing from Links, and started to think about which templates would fit into the places of the routed holes. This process actually led me to the conclusion that I probably cannot beat the routing from Links, so I will go ahead and reuse it. I am using the Links designer to draw the routing in, as this seems to be the simplest way to do it. Below are the 10 new holes I have drawn in, along with the 8 remaining old holes. I will dive into detail on each hole/template in subsequent posts.
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Post by theclv24 on Jan 27, 2018 23:05:10 GMT -5
#1 - Double Plateau - Par 5 - 602 The first hole is a par 5 version of the Double Plateau. The tee shot will likely involve laying up before the ditch, unless you have a really strong tailwind. The second shot must contend with a Mac/Raynor staple on Double Plateau holes, which is the Principal's Nose central hazard, along with the ditch running down the right side. The ditch will also come into play to the right of the green, which will represent a pretty standard Double Plateau, with tiers in the front left and back right.
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Post by Terry Grayson on Jan 27, 2018 23:18:03 GMT -5
OK I love this idea .....Great stuff Craig......
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Post by jacobkessler on Jan 27, 2018 23:57:22 GMT -5
Very interesting concept, will be fun! I’ve always kind of wanted to RCR a real life location and build on it, or redesign an RCR.
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Post by theclv24 on Jan 28, 2018 0:56:38 GMT -5
#2 - (reverse) Redan - Par 4 - 400 I would not have thought to use a Redan with a par 4, nor would I have thought to use two on the course (stay tuned for #11), until I read a course tour of Raynor's Blue Mound in Wisconsin. You could also maybe make an argument that this is a Cape hole, as the ditch affects both the tee shot and approach shot, but for now I am calling this a Redan hole. Since this course is taking the place of a course that serviced almost exclusively high handicappers, I want to include elements to make the course friendlier for those golfers. In this case, those who choose to lay back off of the tee rather than challenging the bunkers or ditch, as well as those who simply don't have the length to do so, the reverse Redan green allows them to play long shots in without having to challenge the ditch directly on the approach. The low handicapper, on the other hand, must decide if they wish to challenge either bunker to shorten the approach in. In general, options help the worse player and sow uncertainty into the better player.
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Post by theclv24 on Jan 28, 2018 1:06:04 GMT -5
#3 - Leven - Par 4 - 416 I am taking a leap here and assuming that I correctly understand the Leven template. Working from the green backwards, a large mound in the front left makes for a semi-blind approach shot for all tee balls that find the left side of the fairway. Add in the angle of the green, which makes it shallower when approaching from the left, plus the water hazard behind, and it is easy to see why the right side is by far the preferred approach angle. To achieve that angle, players must aggressively take on as much of the diagonal fairway bunker as possible.
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Post by Royce on Jan 28, 2018 9:57:25 GMT -5
Really cool idea, looking forward to following the progress on this one!
And you’re not lying, Twin Oaks is a garbage dump. My wife’s side of the family is from Freeland (Tittabawassie road is my 2nd favorite next to Big Beaver) & I’ve spent a lot of time up there. Apple Mountain is what we usually play.
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Post by theclv24 on Jan 28, 2018 14:03:43 GMT -5
Really cool idea, looking forward to following the progress on this one! And you’re not lying, Twin Oaks is a garbage dump. My wife’s side of the family is from Freeland (Tittabawassie road is my 2nd favorite next to Big Beaver) & I’ve spent a lot of time up there. Apple Mountain is what we usually play. I worked at Apple Mountain while I was in school. That one has it's own set of problems, although there are some holes there I remember fondly. Miles away from Twin Jokes. My other plot idea was Beech Hollow, but it's way too small. If your wife went to Freeland any time between about 97 and 03, there is a high likelihood that I know her (it was that small).
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Post by Royce on Jan 28, 2018 14:42:43 GMT -5
Really cool idea, looking forward to following the progress on this one! And you’re not lying, Twin Oaks is a garbage dump. My wife’s side of the family is from Freeland (Tittabawassie road is my 2nd favorite next to Big Beaver) & I’ve spent a lot of time up there. Apple Mountain is what we usually play. I worked at Apple Mountain while I was in school. That one has it's own set of problems, although there are some holes there I remember fondly. Miles away from Twin Jokes. My other plot idea was Beech Hollow, but it's way too small. If your wife went to Freeland any time between about 97 and 03, there is a high likelihood that I know her (it was that small). Small world! My wife isn’t from Freeland but pretty much all of her family is from there/still lives there. I know for sure I have some cousins in the ‘97-03 range that went to Freeland. Kragenbrink, Suave, Darling & Princing are the family surnames from that area.
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Post by theclv24 on Jan 29, 2018 13:04:42 GMT -5
Perhaps I overestimated my abilities, lol, or underestimated the town size. I don't know any of those names.
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Post by theclv24 on Jan 29, 2018 16:54:11 GMT -5
(I am through 12 hole designs, but purposely spacing these out to keep me occupied at work during a slow period) #4 - Road - Par 4 - 431 The Road Hole needs no introduction. This one entices the golfer to carry the right fairway bunkers, as opposed to a hotel and OB, for the right angle into a shallow and angled green guarded in front by a deep bunker. At 431 from the back, it should not be as hard as St Andrews, but certainly is designed to be one of the harder holes on the course. The other tees besides the back tees are all up far enough to give players at every level a chance at trying to clear the bunkers, but a little room to bail short and left, at an albeit horrible angle into the green.
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Post by jacobkessler on Jan 29, 2018 17:28:52 GMT -5
You said you were mapping these out with Links ‘03, right? I wasn’t around the online golf community back in those days so I don’t recognize the interface.
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Post by theclv24 on Jan 30, 2018 9:57:24 GMT -5
You said you were mapping these out with Links ‘03, right? I wasn’t around the online golf community back in those days so I don’t recognize the interface. Yeah, the designer that came with that game was called the Arnold Palmer Course Designer, or APCD. Sounds kind if similar to GNCD, doesn't it? APCD was great for doing what I'm doing, which is drawing out your holes on the plot. Everything after this stage, though, like laying textures and elevating the plot, was like pulling teeth.
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Post by jacobkessler on Jan 30, 2018 11:56:41 GMT -5
You said you were mapping these out with Links ‘03, right? I wasn’t around the online golf community back in those days so I don’t recognize the interface. Yeah, the designer that came with that game was called the Arnold Palmer Course Designer, or APCD. Sounds kind if similar to GNCD, doesn't it? APCD was great for doing what I'm doing, which is drawing out your holes on the plot. Everything after this stage, though, like laying textures and elevating the plot, was like pulling teeth. Cool, may have to look into it just for the purpose of projects like this. Would love to redesign the crappy muni(s) where I grew up!
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Post by theclv24 on Jan 30, 2018 13:07:42 GMT -5
Yeah, the designer that came with that game was called the Arnold Palmer Course Designer, or APCD. Sounds kind if similar to GNCD, doesn't it? APCD was great for doing what I'm doing, which is drawing out your holes on the plot. Everything after this stage, though, like laying textures and elevating the plot, was like pulling teeth. Cool, may have to look into it just for the purpose of projects like this. Would love to redesign the crappy muni(s) where I grew up! Here is where you can still get the game for $7: linkscorner.org/The forum still looks active, so I assume the ability to buy the game is still active. The APCD is included in the installation. Somewhere buried deep in that forum are the instructions for getting the overhead shot into the game at the proper length dimensions so that you can use the measuring tool. I would have to make a deep dive to find it again, as I originally imported that overhead in probably 2013 or 2014, I would guess.
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