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Post by mcbogga on Sept 22, 2017 11:39:29 GMT -5
My suggestion was simply mandating promotion to TST for average scores (over maybe 10 rounds) below a certain threshold. Make the TST the PGA/Euro Tour for the true elites. Make it a badge of honor to be promoted to play there. TST should be kept open. No aids is more preference than anything else, there are plenty of top players WHO prefer playing with training wheels on. But they would adapt and play to the same relative level without aids as well. Forcing how people is not the way. |
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Post by troubleclef721 on Sept 22, 2017 14:45:35 GMT -5
Not sure I agree that the top players would master the TST the same scoring level. We should test it and see.
This idea that it would be "forcing" people to play a certain way is no different than forcing players to play in certain flights. Which is ok.
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Post by ErixonStone on Sept 22, 2017 14:50:59 GMT -5
Not sure I agree that the top players would master the TST the same scoring level. We should test it and see. This idea that it would be "forcing" people to play a certain way is no different than forcing players to play in certain flights. Which is ok. except that this new "flight" plays by different rules. It's not the same game. I would quit before I played any TST rounds (don't worry, I'm nowhere near good enough, but in TGC1 on PC, I was). Players putting up ridiculous scores will navigate their way to the pro tours eventually. You won't have to worry about them in your flight for too long. |
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Post by mcbogga on Sept 22, 2017 15:28:13 GMT -5
Not sure I agree that the top players would master the TST the same scoring level. We should test it and see. This idea that it would be "forcing" people to play a certain way is no different than forcing players to play in certain flights. Which is ok. Just have a look at the TST leaderboards..... Sure it is not the same score level as everyone will hit it further from the hole and make less putts in TST. But relatively the same guys are at the top. Im sure its not universal as green reading is somewhat of a new skillset without grids, but over a year of TST has shown that the best are still the best. It has also shown that no grids play is a niche interrest and not for everyone. I think it is the best and purest way to play this game, but this idea would not benefit TGCT. |
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Post by edi_vedder on Sept 22, 2017 19:39:04 GMT -5
Not sure I agree that the top players would master the TST the same scoring level. We should test it and see. TST is not here since yesterday. No need to test that any further. The majority of top players who have tried/played on TST style have shown they can do it without aids too. |
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Post by pc17 on Oct 27, 2017 7:52:23 GMT -5
The problem with the TST, is that it's not actually a true sim. I tried playing this tour for a while, but I just couldn't get my head around the greens with no grid. I could not see the contours on the green like I could in real life. Having no wind showing was a problem. In real life you can feel the wind in your face. You can throw grass in the air to get an idea of the direction it's blowing. So having no idea what the wind was doing didn't seem natural. But having said that, I really wish the tours were based on the TST. If it was done right it could be really exiting, and certainly more rewarding when you get things right.
1. Include the wind, but show the wind constantly changing. Having a variant in the wind means you only have a rough idea what the wind is doing, just like in real life.
2. Remove the distance-to-pin from within the game. If the in game course map was detailed correctly, you should be calculating distances from yardage markers, like you do in real life.
3. Having a separate map for the green, would allow for more information, like an accurate pin placement and how the green is moving around the pin so you know where to aim, like you do in real life.
4. On the green, show the grid but without any moving beads. This way you would have to look at the gridlines in relation to each other to form an opinion, like you do in real life.
5. In real life you can't zoom down the fairway to see the best line. You can't zoom to the green to see where slopes are. You have to use a course map to get this info. This is how the tours should be played.
If the game was based on what you would have to do in real life during a round, I think that the majority of players would find the game less frustrating because it would become less mechanical. But certainly more rewarding when you get things right. And I'm sure the scoring would reflect this.
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Post by ErixonStone on Oct 27, 2017 13:28:16 GMT -5
If the game was based on what you would have to do in real life during a round, I think that the majority of players would find the game less frustrating because it would become less mechanical. But certainly more rewarding when you get things right. And I'm sure the scoring would reflect this. I think a majority would be more frustrated and the game would become more mechanical. OK, gotta check the overhead for green contours (press a button, zoom, press a button). Then have to calculate distance based on a yardage marker. Then check the wind. Wait. Take an approximate average of the wind.The beauty of TGC is that you can put into the game what you want to put in. Want to do all these checks? You can. But you can also pick up and play a round in under a half hour. And I think a majority of people want to do that. |
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Post by pc17 on Oct 28, 2017 8:13:45 GMT -5
If the game was based on what you would have to do in real life during a round, I think that the majority of players would find the game less frustrating because it would become less mechanical. But certainly more rewarding when you get things right. And I'm sure the scoring would reflect this. I think a majority would be more frustrated and the game would become more mechanical. OK, gotta check the overhead for green contours (press a button, zoom, press a button). Then have to calculate distance based on a yardage marker. Then check the wind. Wait. Take an approximate average of the wind.The beauty of TGC is that you can put into the game what you want to put in. Want to do all these checks? You can. But you can also pick up and play a round in under a half hour. And I think a majority of people want to do that. I appreciate what you are saying Patrick, but I think you have misunderstood the point I was putting across. In the set-up I was suggesting you wouldn't be able to zoom into the green. All the information regarding distance-to-pin, pin position and slopes on the green would have to taken from the course map. This is how all professional, amateurs and serious golfers play everyday, there is nothing mechanical about it. I also appreciate that each round would take a little longer, but if this would make the game and the scoring a little more realistic then I'm all for it. |
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Post by nantez88 on Oct 31, 2017 15:20:44 GMT -5
Just draw your own grids on tracing paper lads and hold it up to the tv and worm cam it. All the top lads do it 😂
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Post by Deleted on Nov 22, 2017 2:41:46 GMT -5
I still don’t get the time-consuming aspect of TST. Takes me 25 mins to do a round. I play every single round tst-style though so I’ve acclimatised to it. Each to their own though.
I think the problem in this game is people are too accurate, even with tour clubs.
Top 10 Green in Reg (PGA TOUR 2016/17)
70.64% - 69.52%
Top 10 Greens in Reg (TST 2017/18)
85.83% - 81.11%
Top players, even with no exact wind meter and no scout cam, are hitting 10-15% more greens than top players in real life. Add in the fact that scrambling is easier than real life, then it’s a recipe for low scoring.
Top 10 Putts per Round (PGA TOUR 2016/17)
28.13 - 28.31
Top 10 Putts per Round (TST 2017/18)
23.75 - 26.25
Top players, even without green grids, are having 2-5 putts less per round than real life. Hard to gauge whether it’s their putting though, as more than likely approach shots are more dialled in than real life. Closer approaches = less putts. However, it goes to show that playing without green grids isn’t too hard.
I’m an average player. Let’s see where I’d stand on the PGA Tour.
GIR
65.28% (107th)
Putts per Round
27.85 (1st)
Hmmm. Below average GiR, probably not helped by using poxy player clubs in half of my rounds as they lack distance. However, top putter, even without grids...pushing and pulling putts could defo be added, almost impossible at the moment.
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