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Post by Deleted on Apr 29, 2019 11:03:07 GMT -5
From Doyley- "4 separate tours by Clubset Difficulty Beginner (all systems) Pro (all systems) Master (PS4) Master (XB1/PC combined)
All 4 would top out at the PGA and then have as many tours below as required by participation. "
Well I for one am elated to read this. The way I read that, all the club types, and systems, will have their own sub tours, but at the top, it will be cross platform
To me, thats the best of all the worlds. If you can make it to the top, where you guys want to be serious about it, the go for it, you have your competition. But for those of us that are simply tired of competing on an uneven/unfair basis, we have a place to do so.
I had pretty much decided that I was going to quit after this season, perhaps even before, if a change like this was not made. I'm not concerned about playing in the PGA. All I want is to be able to play others on a weekly basis, using the same clubs that I do, and without the tempo advantage that the PS4 seems to give. Thats it. I love the competition, but I wanna play masters clubs, and I'm not going out and buying a PS4 just to play a golf game.
If raindrops were like gumdrops and I could anything, I wanted, I'd love to see a seniors tour, where those of us that do have limitations like loss of reflexes, thumb twitches, etc, could happily be, but thats ok, just a personal thing there. My guess is that someone would come in and say they had a problem just to sandbag and win. LOL
The reason I quit TST as an admin and player is for the same reason. It is hard enough competing against easier difficulty levels (clubs) and tempo but add to that people using ghost balls for green reads in a supposedly sim tour. I just had zero enjoyment in the end so why bother, it just felt like a chore each week to play. In an ideal world the platforms would be equal in difficulty and the difficulties of the clubs would be evenly balanced. Tbh the game is a total mess unfortunately on that front in reality.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 29, 2019 11:25:19 GMT -5
This, in my opinion, is probably the answer... Especially if we can code it so there's rankings by console as well.
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Post by Cyclerob on Apr 29, 2019 11:27:30 GMT -5
My guess is that we should wait for the next iteration of this game. TGC2 was really tough to keep in the cone with top clubs on PS4, this version is easier for me to hit within' the blue line. Maybe HB will better adjust this in the next game for each consoles/PC. Minds you, last PGA tournament I finished 27th according to the PS4 leaderboard, but I finished in 52th place on the TGCTours leaderboard. Seems like guys on XboX and PC did allright!
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Post by Doyley on Apr 29, 2019 12:38:43 GMT -5
Minds you, last PGA tournament I finished 27th according to the PS4 leaderboard, but I finished in 52th place on the TGCTours leaderboard. Seems like guys on XboX and PC did allright! Last PGA event from the top 52+ties 48 PS4 (90.5%) 5 PC (9.5%) 0 XB1 (0%) Top XB1 player was 68th
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Post by Cyclerob on Apr 29, 2019 12:48:06 GMT -5
Minds you, last PGA tournament I finished 27th according to the PS4 leaderboard, but I finished in 52th place on the TGCTours leaderboard. Seems like guys on XboX and PC did allright! Last PGA event from the top 52+ties 48 PS4 (90.5%) 5 PC (9.5%) 0 XB1 (0%) Top XB1 player was 68th Well I guess the PS4 leaderboard was not so accurate! Lol
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Post by Deleted on Apr 29, 2019 12:53:26 GMT -5
Last PGA event from the top 52+ties 48 PS4 (90.5%) 5 PC (9.5%) 0 XB1 (0%) Top XB1 player was 68th Well I guess the PS4 leaderboard was not so accurate! Lol It's accurate, most likely there's just a lot of filler scores from vodka types.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 29, 2019 13:06:41 GMT -5
Minds you, last PGA tournament I finished 27th according to the PS4 leaderboard, but I finished in 52th place on the TGCTours leaderboard. Seems like guys on XboX and PC did allright! Last PGA event from the top 52+ties 48 PS4 (90.5%) 5 PC (9.5%) 0 XB1 (0%) Top XB1 player was 68th Those 5 PC players are true heroes in my book 😃. Now that is a shocking statistic, never realised it was that bad 😮 Edit: looks like most PC and Xbox were playing on a different leaderboard for this tournament anyway, the 54 and below one.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 29, 2019 13:07:48 GMT -5
Worth showing this post from Doyley just now in the PGA thread, it's exactly what I've been saying since switching to PS4. When I say tempo is so much easier on PS4, some are like "I get bad tempos too, it's not automatic!". Yeah we get bad tempos on PS4 too, but nowhere near as many - in the example below, a disastrous tempo round with "a zillion fast downswings" is still much better than the best XB1 player's tempo round. Unless you've played on multiple platforms it's difficult to digest how huge the platform difference is for the vast majority of players. Meanwhile the pitchfork mob is always out in full force against a handful of PS4 short swingers, whose advantage is minuscule compared to the advantage PS4 has over the other platforms. Hopefully this gives everyone some perspective.
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Post by moneyman273 on Apr 29, 2019 14:04:05 GMT -5
Potential problem being when they release a new game, it’s open season again as to where the advantage will lie. I’m happy with whatever the admins can do. I don’t hate the random XBox tempo, it makes scoring and the whole game more realistic once you buy into it and accept no pro golfer is perfect so why should my guy be on what’s supposed to be a kind of sim. There’s people playing Web on XBox that I’m absolutely competing with on a level playing field. Can see the advantages and like the fact we got a quick reply from Doyley letting us know it’s on the table 👍 I've said this a thousand times: The "difficulty" on the Xbox console is PERFECT. The problem is, the best Xbox console players barely make top 20 in TGCT events, with a rare win from an Xbox console player. I've been told by dozens of players that it's Robot Golf on the PS4. It's been my wish from the beginning that somehow, the level of difficulty on the PS4 become much greater, while leaving the difficulty on Xbox as is. I'm totally with you here Ray.
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Post by moneyman273 on Apr 29, 2019 14:06:03 GMT -5
How ironic is it that this SAME topic regarding competiveness is brought up from time to time (more specifically, club set difficulty), and I see the masses go "not this argument again............" as they tar and feather the OP for beating a dead horse. But not this time................
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Post by moneyman273 on Apr 29, 2019 14:25:58 GMT -5
Worth showing this post from Doyley just now in the PGA thread, it's exactly what I've been saying since switching to PS4. When I say tempo is so much easier on PS4, some are like "I get bad tempos too, it's not automatic!". Yeah we get bad tempos on PS4 too, but nowhere near as many - in the example below, a disastrous tempo round with "a zillion fast downswings" is still much better than the best XB1 player's tempo round. Unless you've played on multiple platforms it's difficult to digest how huge the platform difference is for the vast majority of players. Meanwhile the pitchfork mob is always out in full force against a handful of PS4 short swingers, whose advantage is minuscule compared to the advantage PS4 has over the other platforms. Hopefully this gives everyone some perspective. As an Xbox player, I've COMPLETELY adjusted my game for the 7/10 F/F, F/P, P/F swings. I love it and it makes my great shots feel that much more important. 2/10 VF absolutely takes 2-3 strokes off my round each time. 1/10 P/P is actually a disadvantage for me because I know not to try for it. When I get it, it's completely unintended and actually makes my shot worse.
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Epiphanic
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TGCT Name: Nicholas Aakre
Tour: CC-Am/TST
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Post by Epiphanic on Apr 29, 2019 14:30:14 GMT -5
Minds you, last PGA tournament I finished 27th according to the PS4 leaderboard, but I finished in 52th place on the TGCTours leaderboard. Seems like guys on XboX and PC did allright! Last PGA event from the top 52+ties 48 PS4 (90.5%) 5 PC (9.5%) 0 XB1 (0%) Top XB1 player was 68th Something is off here. According to Cyclerob, 51 players (across all platforms) finished ahead of him in the last event. Of those 51 players, 26 of them were PS4 players (evidenced by his 27th finish on the console leaderboard). That means 25 PC/Xbox players must make up the remainder. Yet there were only 5? Where are the remaining 20? If it was the other way around (52nd PS4; 27th TGCT), then I could see how it'd work. Players who aren't actually in the Tour playing anyway (and scoring well!) or API failures being removed from the leaderboards. Maybe the console leaderboard is incorrect and Rob finished much lower than 27th on the PS4? Maybe the leaderboard he saw wasn't final?
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Post by rhino4life on Apr 29, 2019 14:42:51 GMT -5
It's on the table for next season - as for this season, barring a 2-3 week break I don't see it happening unless Tim says it's possible. That's a huge change on the backend and how everything else (q-school) etc feeds into it. So while I think it has merit - I don't see it happening before September. For the record, the plan I'm playing with - assuming the game (or next version) remains the same is..... 4 separate tours by Clubset Difficulty Beginner (all systems) Pro (all systems) Master (PS4) Master (XB1/PC combined) All 4 would top out at the PGA and then have as many tours below as required by participation. The data shows that on Master clubs XB1 and PC are fairly close with regards to tempo and combined they are relatively close to the PS4 userbase in numbers. Data also shows that on Pro Clubs and Beginner clubs all 3 systems are balanced well so they would not need to be split up by console. If they fix the balance issue then we could do the above with 3 tours instead of 4 by only having 1 Master Tour. I think the days of 1 tour fits all is in the past though. Love that this idea is being considered. It sucks that the "cross-platform" concept and "community bonding" this place has been known for since the early days would transition towards what we work with today but the reality is cross platform events and community bonding has been dying a slow death since TGC2. Yes, we do have some guys running some side events offline but its not the same as it was in the early days. I think relying on HB to fix or right the wrongs we have to deal with is wishful thinking. If they fix one or two things they will turn around and break three others. Obviously if there are massive changes to the swing to the next game then we would need to take this slowly but without question things right now are broken from a competitive aspect and I am glad the leadership is taking things into consideration in making some changes.
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Post by rhino4life on Apr 29, 2019 14:45:13 GMT -5
How ironic is it that this SAME topic regarding competiveness is brought up from time to time (more specifically, club set difficulty), and I see the masses go "not this argument again............" as they tar and feather the OP for beating a dead horse. But not this time................ LOL....imagine if an Xbox person started this post.
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Post by killahbeaz132 on Apr 29, 2019 15:16:27 GMT -5
Minds you, last PGA tournament I finished 27th according to the PS4 leaderboard, but I finished in 52th place on the TGCTours leaderboard. Seems like guys on XboX and PC did allright! Last PGA event from the top 52+ties 48 PS4 (90.5%) 5 PC (9.5%) 0 XB1 (0%) Top XB1 player was 68th I think I was the one that was 68th or close to it. If we're talking about the tournament at the Buck Club I think I was 62nd. I like to think that I'm one of the better XB1 players that's out there (not bragging at all, just trying to make a point quickly). I look at the XB1 leaderboard each week in the PGA tour and a lot of times I'm near the top of it and on some occasions, that means I'm barely making the cut in the overall PGA tour leaderboard (some are better than others depending on the kind of week I'm having lol). I think it was mentioned by someone earlier in the thread that they don't care about their rankings amongst their own console. I actually do take stock in that ranking and I know that I'm only behind 1 other XB1 player in the world rankings and top XB1 player on the FedEx Cup points. All that being said though, I think that competing against the best players in the world, regardless of console, is a huge part of the appeal. XB1 players, which are all I can speak for because I haven't played on other systems, can compete at the highest level. Is it difficult? Yes of course. Is it impossible, I really don't think it is. Maybe that's the optimist in me but I really do believe that when I play I do have a chance to win. That's what motivates me to play better because I'd like to be that XB1 player that does win on the PGA tour one day. I've had weeks where I'm in the top 20 after 2 rounds or so and I just end up having a sh%$ round with some jacked up tempo. If we can pull it together for 4 rounds, I think any console can be competitive, even if it is more difficult. I do believe having that leaderboard that you can break up by console on the site would be cool just so that people can see it and you can know where you stand on your own console. Sure, for now PS4 players rule the roost on the PGA tour, but think about how cool it would be to see a XB1 player win on PGA? I think that's a story worth telling. May not be an ESPN 30 for 30 or anything, but still a cool story Splitting tours eliminates that possibility for that kind of awesome accomplishment.
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