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Post by Deleted on Nov 21, 2014 21:47:26 GMT -5
simply put, if the leader of a tour is found to have chipped from the green when it could have been avoided, he is disqualified, no need to police the entire field. play with some of the better ghost balls, if you see them chip from the green, mention it and have their rounds revoked, this of course would be optional (the mention it part)
but in all honesty, the top players should not be chipping from the green, because they should know how to putt. so if one is caught doing so, i see nothing wrong with a DQ
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skrec
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TGCT Name: Chris Gollain
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Post by skrec on Nov 21, 2014 22:04:19 GMT -5
i disagree. a putter should be used if it can be used while on the green. only exceptions to me are: obstacles in the way such as bunkers, fringe/fairway getting in the way of the projected path, or its so far or uphill the putter does not have enough juice to make it to the destination. imo chipping/pitching from the green under any circumstance not listed above is exploiting the game of golf, while there may not be any rules that state it, the greens were designed to be putted from, not chipped off of, and that is the sole reason why its frowned upon at most local tracks. You are missing the point. Most people dont disagree with you, its just impossible to police. Personally I dont like it but at the end of the day it makes the shots easier and when this starts I am not going to be putting when 60ft from the pin on the green and deliberately give myself a disadvantage over the field. This is a very obvious case of if you cant beat them, join them, or accept you will lose shots on them in certain situations. so you're saying you'd rather "cheat" and win than play fairly and finish 5th? |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 22, 2014 2:52:24 GMT -5
I'm sorry to burst any bubbles, while most greens-keepers frown on the idea, the USGA allows for any club to be used on any stroke, so it is indeed, legal to chip while on the putting surface. And has been done in several tournaments, I know Phill Michelson has done it several years back.
Thus, it is not cheating. I have done it several times IRL, to avoid having to putt threw fringe/first cut, due to the shape of green. It is a risky shot to pull off without damaging the green ... you damn sure don't want to take a divot in front of your 4-some ...
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Post by Deleted on Nov 22, 2014 9:25:08 GMT -5
What about on massive greens with pins tucked in the corner where the grid doesnt cover the entire green? I remember playing a practice round on Son Gual, my approach out of the rough on the 18th didnt quite make it to the top tier and the grid ends at the start of the slope. My ball ran all the way down to the bottom of the green leaving probably half the green without the grid to putt on.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 22, 2014 10:14:39 GMT -5
I look at it like this, the maximum distance off the flat stick (I've seen in game) is 170 feet(56 yds) and it is usually less.
I have seen horrific long greens, with "RED LINE" slopes, staring you in the face, the hole 65 feet away ... and the putter at full swing couldn't make the top of the slope, and having the ball rolled past the point I started the putt.
I frown on chipping off the green, but there are special times when that call needs to be made. If it's good enough for the PGA Tour, and USGA hasn't outlawed it. Then I will consider the option. It is not illegal. Just unorthodox and frowned upon. I find it less offensive than a player using a 'Hori', or 'edging' to gain advantage ...
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Post by NCFCRulz on Nov 22, 2014 17:50:49 GMT -5
You are missing the point. Most people dont disagree with you, its just impossible to police. Personally I dont like it but at the end of the day it makes the shots easier and when this starts I am not going to be putting when 60ft from the pin on the green and deliberately give myself a disadvantage over the field. This is a very obvious case of if you cant beat them, join them, or accept you will lose shots on them in certain situations. so you're saying you'd rather "cheat" and win than play fairly and finish 5th? Its not cheating, so yeah, quite happily... People should stop complaining about this, as stated any club can be used for any shot at any position on the course. I could putt with my driver in real life if i wished to. So yes, I am going to use the shot I am best at to complete the hole in fewest shots. When on green in real life that may be putting, on the game it may be chipping, i dont give a **** its not breaking any rules and I want to get the ball in the god damn hole. To the guy saying they should be DQ'd if leader is found to chip... What for? playing a legal shot? And even if it wasn't legal, you cant DQ someone for a shot which others may have also played JUST because they finished 1st! That would be discriminatory against the better players |
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snapdecks
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Post by snapdecks on Nov 22, 2014 19:02:51 GMT -5
I had a feeling this would turn into horigate round two.  And i hope it doesn't. Yes it doesn't seem right if people are doing it non stop, no it's not against the rule, yes in some forms it seems against the spirit of the game. As much as I'm not a huge fan if it is used constantly I don't feel as though it's something that is worth such scrutiny. 2c |
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Post by coruler2 on Nov 22, 2014 20:08:40 GMT -5
I chip on the greens about once every 5-6 rounds in the game because there's two conditions that makes putting nearly impossible- 1) Putts over 80ft...especially if they are uphill. I max out the backswing and follow thru speed and still end up 20ft short...you should always be able to putt the ball far enough to get to the hole...but I found it is not the case in the game. 2) Severe tier which makes stopping a downhill putt impossible.
I've chipped on the green about 10 times in real life due to fringe/bunker in the way between me and the pin, or the 2nd condition above. The top condition is just a limitation in the game.
This is where I stand...should be allowed. I don't see anybody really abusing chipping on the green. Of course, by not taking a strong line...you are inviting people to manipulate this in the game. If somehow chipping does become easier v. putting while on the green, it will ruin everything.
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skrec
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TGCT Name: Chris Gollain
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Post by skrec on Nov 22, 2014 22:46:12 GMT -5
Here in Canada most local rules (usually found on the scorecard) prohibit the use of wedges/irons on greens and the ones that don't completely prohibit it specify that it is only certain holes that it is deemed acceptable usually because of an obstruction cutting into the green, so technically it is illegal under the local rules
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Post by Deleted on Nov 22, 2014 23:33:11 GMT -5
This discussion isn't about chipping on the greens when left with no other option, it's about doing so when a putter could and should have been used, such as 30-50 foot putts with some break, where using anything other than a putter is simply easier
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Post by Deleted on Nov 23, 2014 0:06:17 GMT -5
This discussion isn't about chipping on the greens when left with no other option, it's about doing so when a putter could and should have been used, such as 30-50 foot putts with some break, where using anything other than a putter is simply easier This discussion is Bizarre to say the least, no matter how many times someone says, a. it's not against the rules, b. the game allows it, c. You cannot prohibit it by it local rules. There's specific rules that allows specific golf clubs or Local organizations whereby they are given some leeway to make their own rules or slightly vary existing rules of golf. But the rules that Local organizations are allowed to amend are limited and specific. The specifics rules Local clubs are allowed to amend are as follows and limited to only these and nothing else, Young Trees, Ties, Stones in Bunkers, Preferred Lies (Winter Rules), Practice Areas, Out of Bounds, Overhead Power Lines, Obstructions, Ground Under Repair, Environmentally Sensitive Areas (ESA), Embedded Ball, Distance Measuring Devices and Dropping Zones. That's it.
However, no matter how many times this is communicated, we get, but we don't like it we want a rule barring it. The rules of golf should apply here. The game itself has incorporated many of the rules of golf. This discussion is about changing a rule of golf by breaking the rules of golf to prohibit something that some feel is breaking the rules of golf, which it is not. But that simple fact falls on completely deaf ears and is completely ignored like it's just not there.
It's like being in some kind of twilight zone or something. This is not a democracy whereby if enough people think the rule should or should not apply then it happens. If that was the case the stroke and distance OB rule would of been gone long ago. Local clubs have for decades lobbied as well to have the rules amended to allow them to create a local rule regarding that rule to no avail as well.
The rules are rules, I think the rules should apply to everyone, including those individuals asking to have the rules of golf changed, and I think even suggesting to break a rule of golf to appease a few who for whatever reason don't like a specific rule is nuts. I don't like taking a stroke when my ball goes in the water, I should be able to hit 2 off the tee not 3, I should be able to take a mulligan, I should be able to drop at point of entry for OB, etc etc... where does it stop. The rules are there for a reason, follow them please.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 23, 2014 0:24:24 GMT -5
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Post by schrutefarms33 on Nov 23, 2014 0:39:27 GMT -5
couldn't agree more. there's no way this should be an issue. use any club wherever the hell you want to, just like in real golf...
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skrec
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TGCT Name: Chris Gollain
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Post by skrec on Nov 23, 2014 1:21:59 GMT -5
I did say most and royal Montreal would be one of the exceptions to the rule I do believe but Glen Abby however I know for a fact the local rule of no wedges/irons on greens is definitely in effect. Clublink (the conglomerate that owns the Abby among a tonne of other courses) has a 3-way fold scorecard on all courses in which they only show you one side of online... I am currently trying to find and old scorecard from Glen Abby to scan and show you (I bought a gps 2 years ago and keep my scores on there now ) when/if I locate one I will upload for you but as of right now I can't really say you're wrong cause I'm having a hell of a time finding scorecards A.K.A evidence but, I'm almost 100% sure that it is listed on there (Glen Abby scorecard) along with the alcohol, slow play and lightning storm policies that I know are on every Clublink scorecard for liability reasons..
realistically I was hoping this whole discussion would be a moot point because everyone was playing within the spirit of the game and using a putter whenever possible on the green not just because they might have a hard time 2-putting from where they shanked their approach shot to.  somewhere Brad Faxton is crying
If you're going to sit there with a straight face and tell me when you go to the course and have a 55ft putt you just pull out the lob wedge and flop it close to the hole instead of lag putting (or attempting to) then I guess we are living in a fantasy world or you're a superintendents nightmare. Furthermore if any of you had tried this in real life you would see that it is pretty damn hard if not impossible to successfully pull of a flop shot from the tightest of lies.... In the game it is as easy as pie so therefore it is an exploit of the game engine/physics system if you really want to get into it.
oh and here's a link from the Golf Canada (formerly RCPGA) Rules of Golf about local rules.. www.golfcanada.ca/play/the-rules-of-golf/local-rules/ in which it states that "any club may implement local rules specific to their course or competition."
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Post by Mitchblue on Nov 23, 2014 2:46:08 GMT -5
I wouldn't chip IRL on a green for the sake of putting divots all over the green. I doubt any on here would as well, unless faced with a hazard or can't get straight to the pin by putting. That being said I've been guilty of it myself, with varying degrees of success, but should probably stop. I always felt guilty which in itself should have made it seem wrong.
Though there is one case where I putted, max distance, and didn't get close to the hole. Extreme uphill, slow speed putt. Not much else you can do.
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And i hope it doesn't. 
somewhere Brad Faxton is crying 
