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Post by mousepotato on Mar 29, 2021 8:19:21 GMT -5
Bob, don't worry I'm not going to get upset. As for the comment about some players being on a higher tour than they should be on... well I have played on the PGA in previous versions of the game, and I have even stumbled my way to 61st in the world rankings. So I have been able to play the previous games without using any exploits.
There just doesn't seem to be any consistency with the tempo on this version, and I can't see that practicing will make much difference for me. Maybe its the controller? I know there is huge differences from controller to controller so perhaps I have one that doesn't suit the game.
Games are there for enjoyment but it's human nature to be competitive as well. If they nerfed the fasts then a lot of people's scores would plummet so perhaps there would still be a level of competition. As it stands, with the exploit being allowed, I will continue to use it because the alternative is to bin the game completely as the weekly tournament rounds is all that I play.
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Post by dime5150 on Mar 29, 2021 11:56:44 GMT -5
I play a slight fast for the distance increase and consistency. That said I played a round where I shot for perfect, aiming right down the center of the pipe. FIR was not affected either way, in fact a perfect-slight slow seemed more consistent than going for fast.
Only perceived difference at all was slight distance decrease. No more or less difficult than playing a slight fast. As I stated a LONG time ago, shooting for fast is useless on anything besides a tee shot to a fairway. Still need perfect for all approaches
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Post by Cecil Harvey on Mar 30, 2021 1:20:52 GMT -5
Bob, don't worry I'm not going to get upset. As for the comment about some players being on a higher tour than they should be on... well I have played on the PGA in previous versions of the game, and I have even stumbled my way to 61st in the world rankings. So I have been able to play the previous games without using any exploits. There just doesn't seem to be any consistency with the tempo on this version, and I can't see that practicing will make much difference for me. Maybe its the controller? I know there is huge differences from controller to controller so perhaps I have one that doesn't suit the game. Games are there for enjoyment but it's human nature to be competitive as well. If they nerfed the fasts then a lot of people's scores would plummet so perhaps there would still be a level of competition. As it stands, with the exploit being allowed, I will continue to use it because the alternative is to bin the game completely as the weekly tournament rounds is all that I play. I understand defending yourself with your quality play in the past. Human nature and I acknowledge it. Tempo has, unfortunately, been more and more console/platform specific going forward in this series. The new consoles that came out last November do seem to play much better from my experience on PS5 and then from anecdotal evidence from within the XBox only thread in the Clubhouse. Maybe going forward the tempo variance between the platfroms/consoles will again be reduced?!? I certainly hope so. Carry on and keep at it, sir!
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Post by SkyBlueBen on Mar 30, 2021 2:34:56 GMT -5
Followed this (polite) debate with interest.
As one of the poor players mentioned above here's how I sit at this precise moment. Returned to Master after a break in the Beer League. Dropped down through sheer frustration. On coming back I played for perfects. Rarely hitting them. I noticed 80% of the time I got a fast. Sometimes grey, sometimes red. Tried recalibrating but it didn't seemed to make a blind bit of difference. So I changed my tack and started aiming my drives a little further right (right handed player). My fasts continue, some red, some grey, the odd perfect, rarely slow but generally my fairway percentage went up and my approach shots (on which I've ALWAYS played for perfects) became a little easier and my scores improved.
So the question is. What type of cheese am I?
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Post by lessangster on Mar 30, 2021 3:57:03 GMT -5
Followed this (polite) debate with interest. As one of the poor players mentioned above here's how I sit at this precise moment. Returned to Master after a break in the Beer League. Dropped down through sheer frustration. On coming back I played for perfects. Rarely hitting them. I noticed 80% of the time I got a fast. Sometimes grey, sometimes red. Tried recalibrating but it didn't seemed to make a blind bit of difference. So I changed my tack and started aiming my drives a little further right (right handed player). My fasts continue, some red, some grey, the odd perfect, rarely slow but generally my fairway percentage went up and my approach shots (on which I've ALWAYS played for perfects) became a little easier and my scores improved. So the question is. What type of cheese am I? The big cheese in the Brew Crew 😉
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Post by BillySastard976 on Mar 30, 2021 5:24:59 GMT -5
It's much more satisfying to play a good round trying for perfects than a good round playing for fasts. The fast is an exploit, and I don't care how many players say something along the lines of " it's in the game, it's not illegal, I'm simply playing the game with the tools the designers have given me". This to my mind is total bullshit.
What players of the fast are doing is side-stepping a difficult element of the game ( tempo! ) and taking the easy way out. They can justify it in any way they like but that is the bare bones of it. I had sympathy with Xbox players doing it up to a point, as good tempo on Xbox has been extremely difficult to achieve, but not now that 60fps is there for us to use. The fast is the easy way. I really don't think anyone can argue with that.
One small point. Those who say the best players would still be the best, with or without the fast...would they? They would still be good, but how good? It's clear they themselves don't think so or they would be trying for perfects. They know good tempo ( perfects! ) is much more difficult!
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mega8deth8
Weekend Golfer
Posts: 107
Tour: Platinum
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Post by mega8deth8 on Mar 30, 2021 5:48:38 GMT -5
It's much more satisfying to play a good round trying for perfects than a good round playing for fasts. The fast is an exploit, and I don't care how many players say something along the lines of " it's in the game, it's not illegal, I'm simply playing the game with the tools the designers have given me". This to my mind is total bullshit. What players of the fast are doing is side-stepping a difficult element of the game ( tempo! ) and taking the easy way out. They can justify it in any way they like but that is the bare bones of it. I had sympathy with Xbox players doing it up to a point, as good tempo on Xbox has been extremely difficult to achieve, but not now that 60fps is there for us to use. The fast is the easy way. I really don't think anyone can argue with that. One small point. Those who say the best players would still be the best, with or without the fast...would they? They would still be good, but how good? It's clear they themselves don't think so or they would be trying for perfects. They know good tempo ( perfects! ) is much more difficult! And some of us could care less because it's a game and not a job. What I've learned now that I've gotten to the point where irons and wedges are almost automatic perfects is that hitting perfect is just another tool in the bag. I play to the situation and if a red fast is a better shot then that's what I'm hitting. You guys trying to lay on these guilt trips and shame posts is just laughable. Just play your game and don't worry about anyone else. Red fast isn't an instant ticket to the top and I'm sure most of you crying about it wouldn't benefit even if you tried it.
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Post by fadgewacker on Mar 30, 2021 6:07:36 GMT -5
As I stated a LONG time ago, shooting for fast is useless on anything besides a tee shot to a fairway. Still need perfect for all approaches Im quite certain that this isn’t true. Beep Boop Sean Abbot provided video evidence of just how this isn’t the case at all. Once you learn the offset and the distances - Max loft, Max spin to increase your chance of a red fast, and just fire away. This is the problem. [edit] Sorry Sean, if you’re out there - not meaning to be intentionally disingenuous, but Beep Boop is just ingrained in my brain now 😊
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Post by cseanny on Mar 30, 2021 8:22:32 GMT -5
Totten gave me that name back in PGA 2019 Mark! For what it's worth, I quite enjoy the nick!! It's my badge of honor for defeating my competition by so many strokes every tournament I enter. It's more of a compliment than anything else! But yes, the Red Fast is beyond broken. Case in point, I've been playing nothing but Ultra Sim Experience lately in Heavy, VF, VF, VF, and I'm averaging around -13 to -14 a round now, or -52 to -56 per tournament, with a spike of -68!! Red Fast is by far, the most broken exploit HB has ever given us. It is a 100x more powerful than the "flick", or "Push/Pull" from the previous game.
Be very glad the current top Platinum guys aren't using Red Fasts for every shot, otherwise their scoring would be substantially lower than it already is.
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Post by mrohde4 on Mar 30, 2021 9:59:14 GMT -5
It's much more satisfying to play a good round trying for perfects than a good round playing for fasts. The fast is an exploit, and I don't care how many players say something along the lines of " it's in the game, it's not illegal, I'm simply playing the game with the tools the designers have given me". This to my mind is total bullshit. What players of the fast are doing is side-stepping a difficult element of the game ( tempo! ) and taking the easy way out. They can justify it in any way they like but that is the bare bones of it. I had sympathy with Xbox players doing it up to a point, as good tempo on Xbox has been extremely difficult to achieve, but not now that 60fps is there for us to use. The fast is the easy way. I really don't think anyone can argue with that. One small point. Those who say the best players would still be the best, with or without the fast...would they? They would still be good, but how good? It's clear they themselves don't think so or they would be trying for perfects. They know good tempo ( perfects! ) is much more difficult! And some of us could care less because it's a game and not a job. What I've learned now that I've gotten to the point where irons and wedges are almost automatic perfects is that hitting perfect is just another tool in the bag. I play to the situation and if a red fast is a better shot then that's what I'm hitting. You guys trying to lay on these guilt trips and shame posts is just laughable. Just play your game and don't worry about anyone else. Red fast isn't an instant ticket to the top and I'm sure most of you crying about it wouldn't benefit even if you tried it. If we aren't allowed to comment about how others play in a competitive league, is it ok to respond to others' forum posts? Or is that not allowed either? I understand your "don't worry about anyone else" argument, but then how would any exploit, cheat, cheese, etc. ever see the light of day? And where does the line get drawn? How do you think the API parameters against straightshooting from TGC1 or the push/pulling from TGC2019 (just two examples of many) get implemented if everyone just played their own game? Aren't scripters and straight-shooters just playing their own game too? And don't clap back by arguing that those blatant examples of cheating are somehow different. Where the line gets drawn is subjective, and neither of us get to make that call. Either way, it's how others play the game so we shouldn't care, right? TGCTours hasn't come out with an official statement or stance, but maybe check out their Twitter recently. And I believe you meant to say *couldn't* care less. Or maybe not, because you sure seem to care. A lot.
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Post by mrohde4 on Mar 30, 2021 10:13:31 GMT -5
Totten gave me that name back in PGA 2019 Mark! For what it's worth, I quite enjoy the nick!! It's my badge of honor for defeating my competition by so many strokes every tournament I enter. It's more of a compliment than anything else! But yes, the Red Fast is beyond broken. Case in point, I've been playing nothing but Ultra Sim Experience lately in Heavy, VF, VF, VF, and I'm averaging around -13 to -14 a round now, or -52 to -56 per tournament, with a spike of -68!! Red Fast is by far, the most broken exploit HB has ever given us. It is a 100x more powerful than the "flick", or "Push/Pull" from the previous game.
Be very glad the current top Platinum guys aren't using Red Fasts for every shot, otherwise their scoring would be substantially lower than it already is.
Pretty powerful stuff from someone who knows what he's talking about.
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Post by BillySastard976 on Mar 31, 2021 13:03:15 GMT -5
Totten gave me that name back in PGA 2019 Mark! For what it's worth, I quite enjoy the nick!! It's my badge of honor for defeating my competition by so many strokes every tournament I enter. It's more of a compliment than anything else! But yes, the Red Fast is beyond broken. Case in point, I've been playing nothing but Ultra Sim Experience lately in Heavy, VF, VF, VF, and I'm averaging around -13 to -14 a round now, or -52 to -56 per tournament, with a spike of -68!! Red Fast is by far, the most broken exploit HB has ever given us. It is a 100x more powerful than the "flick", or "Push/Pull" from the previous game.
Be very glad the current top Platinum guys aren't using Red Fasts for every shot, otherwise their scoring would be substantially lower than it already is.
Pretty powerful stuff from someone who knows what he's talking about. Do we know that the current top players aren't using the red fast for everything? Perhaps some of us do, I don't watch streams.
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Post by mrohde4 on Mar 31, 2021 13:44:26 GMT -5
Pretty powerful stuff from someone who knows what he's talking about. Do we know that the current top players aren't using the red fast for everything? Perhaps some of us do, I don't watch streams. Unclear because only so many stream, but it's undeniable the widespread use of this strategy throughout all the tours. Nobody argues that it's not easier to execute, yet calling it out is somehow offensive and personal. Assuming we define aim point by the on-screen marker, it's illogical to play a golf video game by hitting the ball away from where your avatar/player is aiming. Real golfers can't trick themselves into guided mishits. I've seen players who exclusively play the red fast on every shot and others only on approaches. Any usage, if intentional, goes against the spirit of competition. But that's just me. While I'm sure many top Plat players use it on every shot, to me their style isn't particularly relevant in the discussion. A red herring. The bigger issue is the widespread use in all 'competitive' tours of an illogical and advantageous strategy that clearly goes against the gameplay and challenges presented by HB.
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Post by nevadaballin on Mar 31, 2021 14:02:19 GMT -5
Pretty powerful stuff from someone who knows what he's talking about. Do we know that the current top players aren't using the red fast for everything? Perhaps some of us do, I don't watch streams. You can tell just by using a ghost ball with turn order on for a few holes.
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Post by dime5150 on Mar 31, 2021 23:44:44 GMT -5
As I stated a LONG time ago, shooting for fast is useless on anything besides a tee shot to a fairway. Still need perfect for all approaches Im quite certain that this isn’t true. Beep Boop Sean Abbot provided video evidence of just how this isn’t the case at all. Once you learn the offset and the distances - Max loft, Max spin to increase your chance of a red fast, and just fire away. This is the problem. [edit] Sorry Sean, if you’re out there - not meaning to be intentionally disingenuous, but Beep Boop is just ingrained in my brain now 😊 Well that’s not my experience and I think that’s what counts for me, also, playing for straights is no more difficult than playing a draw as my test rounds have proven
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