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Post by Bearforlife73 on Jun 5, 2020 13:20:04 GMT -5
So after your done here you should do sheshan golf club
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Post by ezzinomilonga on Jun 5, 2020 15:50:54 GMT -5
So after your done here you should do sheshan golf club I saw there is already some lidar data about China. I never checked them and/or their quality but i can suppose soon or later we could have some good data..so who knows, if there should ever be the lidar data of Sheshan, someone probably could do it before than me. Otherwise yes, i wish to do Sheshan after Nine Bridges. But first of all we must verify if i'm really able to do the good work is required...and, even assuming i can actually do the work properly, i must admit that this way to recreate real courses is really draining in terms of time, energies, patience, everything. Is simply absurd thr amount of time you can save with the lidar. Is one of the reasons why i never understand when i see a lidar course poorly planted, micro-sculpted ..or stuff like this. With the Lidar you have ALL the time to be super accurate in EVERYTHING..is almost a crime to not use this great tool to create only jewels. On another subject, is also true that the structure (routing, terrain, global dimension, but also bunkering or shape of fairways etc) of Sheshan is enough easier than Nine Bridges. And probably, being also more experienced when/if i'll face this (or any else) work, everything should be way faster and smoother of what i experienced in these days, considering i spent a good amount of time simply to find a smart way to do all the misuration works STRAIGHT on the editor (on the real course is quite easy, Google Earth Pro is amazing to do it).
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Post by ezzinomilonga on Jun 9, 2020 22:01:06 GMT -5
2 pics..nothing special..just a way to spend some time while i can't play or work and, why not, to chat a bit and to show some little progress i did before the stop caused by my broken hand and what kind of work (slow and tiring, sometimes really frustrating cause some difficulty for sure avoidable, with a smarter editor...but also funny, after all ) is required to recreate a IRL course. The pics are about the tee's complex of hole 1 and the green and bunkers of hole 2. I know i must still smooth some angle and all the road, but i'm pretty satisfied of the result, at the moment. Furthermore, i decided to change a bit my starting plan (it was to complete the drawing of the first 9 holes and, only after this, then to work on planting and microsculpting) and to create all the surfaces (tees, fairways, bunkers, greens and roads) of holes 1,2,3,8 and 9, THEN start to plant and sculpt everything. THEN to complete holes 5,6 and 7. I'm thinking to do this for 2 reasons. 1) Holes 5,6 and 7 (and also the green of hole 3,actually) are pretty far from the other holes. It will be more difficult (and extremely timesucker), to place them properly on the map. And is honestly annoying to draw only lines for hours. Hundreds of lines..for days!! 2) Following a bit more serious thought about micrisculpting and, mainly, almost all the bunkering, i'm fully aware this will be the real great challenge and difficulty of this course. And hole 8 offers probably the boldest (and most bastard, i could add : they are mainly pot bunkers, EXTREMELY deep and placed all around both sides and in front of the green, they are showed in the 4th pic from above i shared some post before, if you'are curious about) bunkers of all the course. So i believe that if i start ASAP to confrontate myself with this difficulty, it will be more probable and easy i can find in the littlest amount of time is possible the help i could need to solve any issue and find the right solutions, when it will happens. Who knows..i could also find out to be simply unable to work at the level of quality i really want to offer...I don't want discover it just at the end. P.S. : about the editor in the new game, it would be simply fantastic if could be implemented the extremely simple and smart method used by Google Earth Pro to obtain fu#%@%&* straight misurations and lines : Fixing somewhere a North, then just indicate the degrees for the direction of every line you draw..so you could easily verify that a vertical line between 2 points is straight simply because it will result in 0/360/180 degrees..an horizontal line in 90/270. You could also draw every other possible angle in a perfect way in few moments, instead to be forced to add dozens of buildings and every possible kind of objects just to have a fu#%@$ referring point!! (of course, i ask for a friend) >.> P.P.S. : anyway, just to offer a complete update of the situation, at this moment i already completed holes 1,2,3 and the Driving Range (included the big practice green with bunkers). Later today, even if i can't use the mouse for too long before it hurts, i'll try to start to work on that infamous hole 8. The dream would be to complete it and hole 9 tomorrow, then to start with sculpting and planting..then who knows
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Post by hallzballz6908 on Jun 10, 2020 0:10:35 GMT -5
2 pics..nothing special..just a way to spend some time while i can't play or work and, why not, to chat a bit and to show some little progress i did before the stop caused by my broken hand and what kind of work (slow and tiring, sometimes really frustrating cause some difficulty for sure avoidable, with a smarter editor...but also funny, after all ) is required to recreate a IRL course. The pics are about the tee's complex of hole 1 and the green and bunkers of hole 2. I know i must still smooth some angle and all the road, but i'm pretty satisfied of the result, at the moment. Furthermore, i decided to change a bit my starting plan (it was to complete the drawing of the first 9 holes and, only after this, then to work on planting and microsculpting) and to create all the surfaces (tees, fairways, bunkers, greens and roads) of holes 1,2,3,8 and 9, THEN start to plant and sculpt everything. THEN to complete holes 5,6 and 7. I'm thinking to do this for 2 reasons. 1) Holes 5,6 and 7 (and also the green of hole 3,actually) are pretty far from the other holes. It will be more difficult (and extremely timesucker), to place them properly on the map. And is honestly annoying to draw only lines for hours. Hundreds of lines..for days!! 2) Following a bit more serious thought about micrisculpting and, mainly, almost all the bunkering, i'm fully aware this will be the real great challenge and difficulty of this course. And hole 8 offers probably the boldest (and most bastard, i could add : they are mainly pot bunkers, EXTREMELY deep and placed all around both sides and in front of the green, they are showed in the 4th pic from above i shared some post before, if you'are curious about) bunkers of all the course. So i believe that if i start ASAP to confrontate myself with this difficulty, it will be more probable and easy i can find in the littlest amount of time is possible the help i could need to solve any issue and find the right solutions, when it will happens. Who knows..i could also find out to be simply unable to work at the level of quality i really want to offer...I don't want discover it just at the end. P.S. : about the editor in the new game, it would be simply fantastic if could be implemented the extremely simple and smart method used by Google Earth Pro to obtain fu#%@%&* straight misurations and lines : Fixing somewhere a North, then just indicate the degrees for the direction of every line you draw..so you could easily verify that a vertical line between 2 points is straight simply because it will result in 0/360/180 degrees..an horizontal line in 90/270. You could also draw every other possible angle in a perfect way in few moments, instead to be forced to add dozens of buildings and every possible kind of objects just to have a fu#%@$ referring point!! (of course, i ask for a friend) >.> P.P.S. : anyway, just to offer a complete update of the situation, at this moment i already completed holes 1,2,3 and the Driving Range (included the big practice green with bunkers). Later today, even if i can't use the mouse for too long before it hurts, i'll try to start to work on that infamous hole 8. The dream would be to complete it and hole 9 tomorrow, then to start with sculpting and planting..then who knows Love how methodical you’re being with this! All the lines and measurements are enough to make my head spin by themselves! Even if you end up scrapping this project, I’m very impressed by your meticulous attention to detail and your progress so far. I hope your hand gets better soon so you can continue your work (and your life!).
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Post by ezzinomilonga on Jun 10, 2020 1:14:44 GMT -5
hallzballz6908 thank you for your kind words, the support of people like you is, in the end, one of the only two real reasons and gasoline why to start and then finish this kind of enterprises. The other one is the challenge. To confontate with something actually existing, knowing that the quality of your work will be checked and finally appreciated or not in a hard, cold way. As it must be. I always found it exciting. Extremely. In the specific case (also considering my lack of experience in this kind of work) i must admit this course is an ugly beast I spent my first days deciding mainly how much time it would be correct to spend in all this work of misuration but, now, i believe i'm doing the right thing. Maybe on another course i could use less referring points and try simply to shape everything with the splines..but here almost every surface is irregular..all the time saved in misuration, it would be spent in continuos adjustments. Right now, at least, when i draw a surface i need just minimal tweaks. Then i think i'm on the right path for this work.
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Post by sandsaver01 on Jun 10, 2020 6:43:25 GMT -5
Ezzino, you are a Prince for doing this! I certainly would not have the patience or dedication to do this without Lidar (or some other kind of Digital Elevation Map as in the TW08 days) and I applaud your persistence and pursuit of accuracy.
In some place further back in this thread you talk about designers just using the Lidar and not putting effort into making things realistic. I was upset about that also, but then I realized that they are probably doing it just because they or others want to play the course, either on a console, PC, or most likely a Simulator. They are not really intended to be pretty, just playable.
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Post by ezzinomilonga on Jun 10, 2020 7:30:06 GMT -5
Ezzino, you are a Prince for doing this! I certainly would not have the patience or dedication to do this without Lidar (or some other kind of Digital Elevation Map as in the TW08 days) and I applaud your persistence and pursuit of accuracy. In some place further back in this thread you talk about designers just using the Lidar and not putting effort into making things realistic. I was upset about that also, but then I realized that they are probably doing it just because they or others want to play the course, either on a console, PC, or most likely a Simulator. They are not really intended to be pretty, just playable. I'm aware of it mate, and i absolutely understand (and actually totally support) who creates Lidar courses just with this intent. I could also say i admire these guys, cause they offers in any case a good service for the community, at least to offer an idea of what a course can offer in terms of playability. Is also true that i'm not a hard rock fanatic of quality, actually. I pretend a lot by myself but i'm quite easy on the other guys works. And i'm ready to accept always (or almost) a compromize between quality and playability, if is made with common sense...and possibly with some love, passion etc.. But do you know what? On the list of RCR's i'm still working on, i have almost 1600 courses, now. And even not counting all those non Lidar courses that unfortunally i had still not time to verify properly (and i'm pretty sure something like 5/600 of these courses would be erased or, anyway, for sure not considered RCRs anymore..and i did if i'll ever find the time) i believe we still have nothing less than 500/700 sure lidar courses, right now. But the truth is that the huge majority of these courses are made clearly with the only desire to release a course in the less time is possible. And this is just sad. Even a little or not famous at all course could offer some joy and some good reason to be played, if presented in the proper way. About my work here...thank you for the compliment, you make me smile ..but if i want to be considered a real Prince AFTER doing this thing, all we know that the only way is to reach a certain final result..with not BUT or IF. What makes the creation of a RCR a different thing is that the will, the good faith, the crazy amount of work, the sleepless nights, all the passion you can put in..nothing really matters if the result is less than spot on. The result is everything. It couldn't be more exciting than this,isn't?
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scoll3
Amateur Golfer
Posts: 180
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Post by scoll3 on Jun 10, 2020 12:04:55 GMT -5
Wow I’m super impressed by your work here! I know it takes forever, but this is only going to dramatically improve your final product. If it is ever too much, don’t be afraid to simplify to make things easier for you. I don’t want you to go insane because of this project haha! But it sounds like you’re enjoying the process which is great.
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Post by ezzinomilonga on Jun 10, 2020 13:29:33 GMT -5
Wow I’m super impressed by your work here! I know it takes forever, but this is only going to dramatically improve your final product. If it is ever too much, don’t be afraid to simplify to make things easier for you. I don’t want you to go insane because of this project haha! But it sounds like you’re enjoying the process which is great. I'm confident i'll remain more or less sane (but sane is a big word, maybe, if related to me and this game)..after all i'm not the first who tries to do this I could also say that i'm here exactly cause we have some real artist for this kind of works..and it would be a true dream to be good enough even just to follow a bit their footsteps. But of course yes, is good to know the course would be looking good, right now, if we could play it in 2 dimensions I can assure the entusiasm will not disappear, i'm ready to spend myself totally for this project. My only frustration is sometimes because if the editor should have simply a smarter way to keep straight lines, even this work apparently annoying would be a party, for me. But i hope that alternating a bit all the mesurations work with some day spent only sculpting and planting, everything will stay enjoyable until the end. Anyway..next update only when i'll have something to show in third dimension, i swear Thank you, i appreciated a lot your words
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Post by golfwolfuk on Jun 11, 2020 12:16:54 GMT -5
I’m liking the commitment to details here. Thank you, and can’t wait
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Post by ezzinomilonga on Jun 12, 2020 21:59:54 GMT -5
I’m liking the commitment to details here. Thank you, and can’t wait No..thank you to you! I'm a bit sorry only because i wish to say the waiting will be short..but i would be a liar. Or totally naive. I'm already pretty sure the course will be ended shortly before (if not after) the release of the new game, if nothing goes wrong, unless i'll find a way to have A LOT of free time in these months..(But is also true that if i should continue to struggle to find a new work in the next weeks...i could definitely have it!! ) About the committment on details, of course i have the desire to recreate in the most accurate i can every fairway, bunker, green etc..and i'll do it at my best. And i can't explain how much i really love the fact that all you guys are appreciating and supporting the effort but, after all, i think that if some precision is possible to be reached, it would be just stupid to renounce only to save some week. But i'm fully and well aware this is only a little part of the work required, if i really want to offer a solid work to our community. And i want exactly this. I have still in my eyes some masterpiece realized with the same technic and amount of sacrifices by designers (artists, to be fair) who, with their hard work, offered to me HOURS, if not MONTHS, of true, fantastic fun. No counting all the great guys i have the chance to know and appreciate, being part of this. I really want to give to this community something back. Nothing less. Nothing more. With this premise, you can see how the commitment to details is just the minimum starting point. And could also means nothing, in the end, because i could spend even 2 sleepless months just to shape perfectly every inch of this course, with success, but still the final product could be weak..if not awful. I firmly believe the real challenge will start exactly at the end of this part of the work. And well..i'm excited as a little virgin
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Post by ezzinomilonga on Jun 19, 2020 13:12:26 GMT -5
Fast update (pics will follow tonight or before than Sunday, when the work will be at some good point) and a little request of help and/or an opinion. Now that the layout of holes 1, 2, 3, 8 and 9 is complete (and pretty accurate, i would say ), i started today with the sculpting. But, before, i spent last days checking every video i found about the course, collecting all the new, useful pics i can extract from these footages. It has been a long, very long work (i have more than 800 pics, at the moment) but i'm sure it will be very useful, not only on sculpting and planting, but even to place properly every pin positions, all the tournament stuff and all the possible nuances that could make this course more precise, enjoyable and nice looking. This work has been useful even because a good number of pics i collected were taken before some renovation work (mainly on bunkering, but also on the shape of some fairway and green) made shortly before the first edition of the CJ Cup (Just to say, in the official site of Nine Bridges, maps and flyovers are not updated, creating some confusion, while the official site and the official YouTube Channel of the CJ Cup offers the updated course and a lot of videos really useful to make the accurate work i absolutely want to obtain). Then, the good news are that i have a very clear idea of what to do and in the next days i'll work hard to complete all these holes before to start the drawing of the clubhouse zone and holes 10 and 18, the most famous hole of the course. The only real doubt i still have..and here is where i need some help/advice, is what theme to use on this course. As i said before, the vaste majority of trees on this course are asian maples, that basically are conic shaped trees. The sycomores offered by the rustic/countryside theme could fits easily dor this purpose, but is also true that, looking lot of pics of the course taken on different seasons, i must admit the autumn theme could fit in a fantastic way, if the different colors are used with a bit of common sense..but i always had different feelings about this theme. I fear it could look "redundant" in some way, if the word makes some sense.. For your experience, there is some reason why i should prefer the rustic/countryside theme to the autumn? And, if i should use the autumn theme, there is some thing to know before to start with planting that could make the difference between a good and a bad result?
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Post by ezzinomilonga on Jun 27, 2020 6:40:00 GMT -5
Well..Hole 1 is almost done. Is still missing the microsculpting on green (i'll do as the last thing, cause i wish to try to improve a bit the bunker near the green, although i'm not sure the editor will actually allows it, but i'll try) and also the planting is to be considered just a way to take referring points, in fact i'll also recreate only the first line of trees around every hole, while for the final and "real" accurate planting, i'll wait for the next game, cause i really dislike some solution i'm forced to implement right now..and i sincerely hope in the next game we'll have some option more about this thing, but i'm enough satisfied about the general result, at least. This is a panoramic of all i did until now. Today i started to work on Hole 2, it should be a shorter and way easier work than on hole 1. I also decided that i'll use the countryside theme. The harvest just don't satisfied me. About planting, one of my other doubts was if to use maples (in the left side of the pic) or sycomores (in the right side), but i'll probably use maples, unless in the new game i'll find something better fitting. There is not so much other to say..i need simply to continue to work...and i'll do Ah, no..there is to add that i'm already sure there will be at least 2 versions of this course, one for tournament pourposes, with all the tournament stuff etc.., with max 3 tees. And one for "members" with no tournament stuff and all the 5 tees offered. This will be necessary because i noticed that, at least on hole 1, the tee used on the PGA Tour is not the first, but the second, with a stand placed where actually the first tee is. I still have not checked all the others tees, then is possible the same thing happens on some other hole.
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Post by sandsaver01 on Jun 27, 2020 7:14:21 GMT -5
Looks good Ezzino! I might sink those fairway bunkers down a bit with sharper slopes around them so they look more like the picture, but otherwise great.
Bad news though, there are no Maples in the "Countryside" theme. I know because that is what I am using for The Trophy Club right now. The course has Maples but I have to use something else. I settled on Countryside because the background is flat like the one IRL. There are also no conifers (Pines, Spruces, etc.) in Countryside if you need them. You might consider Rustic instead if you don't mind the hilly backdrop; I used it on Old White and it has Maples and Conifers.
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Post by ezzinomilonga on Jun 27, 2020 7:36:59 GMT -5
Looks good Ezzino! I might sink those fairway bunkers down a bit with sharper slopes around them so they look more like the picture, but otherwise great. Bad news though, there are no Maples in the "Countryside" theme. I know because that is what I am using for The Trophy Club right now. The course has Maples but I have to use something else. I settled on Countryside because the background is flat like the one IRL. There are also no conifers (Pines, Spruces, etc.) in Countryside if you need them. You might consider Rustic instead if you don't mind the hilly backdrop; I used it on Old White and it has Maples and Conifers. Oh sh!t..you're right! I totally forgot i finally decided to use the rustic theme. I was sure i was still working with the countryside theme About bunkers, i already noticed it but, as for the one before the green, i'll make all these adjustements when i'll be sure i'll have no more needs to touch anymore the terrain around it. I have a long video (1H40) still to check carefully, made by 4 Korean guys who plays the course, with 2 cameras..and this video is full of great details..and i'll use it for all those little adjustment to make to obtain a perfect result (or something like this ). If you look the left side of the fairway, there is also a point that needs to be a bit more elevated (i did it after i took the pic )..and i think there are a lot of these little improvements still to make, here and there. I'm really enthusiast, because i found (after weeks of researches) a LOT of great material to use for this course..and if i can find some good footage about every pin position of all the 4 days used for the PGA Tour, i'm very confident this work could be really, really accurate, in the end. About the rustic theme, it fits in a great way with this course even exactly because that hilly backdrop. Nine Bridges is totally surrounded by hills full of trees. I'll need also to create a pair of these hills between the 2 loops of nine. Also the default heavy rough fits really well with the course, although i probably will prefer to create it with the splines, at least around the fairways.
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