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Post by nevadaballin on Sept 2, 2017 2:50:37 GMT -5
I should also point out that, while President Trump may be incompetent, a jerk, and just plain bad (all opinions), he hasn't done anything that is illegal. That's important to note. That we don't like his actions isn't grounds for impeachment. Unless something comes back from "that Russia thing," we're stuck with him until at least 2020. Still waiting for a glimpse of those tax returns  |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2017 4:30:35 GMT -5
FRSTDWN Shall we put an end to the belief by Americans that the Canadian Healthcare system is broken. It is far from broken. The wait list argument, yes there is a wait list, but only those who can wait, wait. All Canadians know other Canadians who have received life saving operations within hours of entering the system. Yeah, things like knee replacement, yeah you have to wait, there is not thousands of doctors standing around to do knee replacement surgeries. Canadians flocking to the US for healthcare. Well, some Canadians like some Americans believe you will get better care if you pay for it versus not paying for it. However flocking is vastly over stated. The Canadian healthcare system currently treats more Americans then American systems treating Canadians to a factor of 5 to 1. Another fact that largely gets ignored by Americans, that I find curious and would like someones opinion on the opposite side. Presently I pay taxes, yeah some may say to much tax, fine whatever, not my point here. My taxes are used to provide my free healthcare among about a million other things. The government puts whatever amount of billions of dollars into the healthcare system. Break those numbers down into a per Canadian into whatever amount you get. Now Americans also pay taxes, some pay extra for Health Insurance, some get it through work, some just rely on Emergency care. Now the American Government also pays whatever billions of dollars into the Healthcare system to provide for senior care, emergency care etc. But if you were to break down those numbers to dollars per American, the American Government spends more tax dollars per American than the Canadian Governments spend per Canadian. OK tried to condense that, hope that makes sense. But, my question. How can that possibly be OK. You spend enough tax dollars already to pay for everyone, if you take profit out of the system, why not support a single payer system? Also, thank you FRSTDWN For the first time ever, I see an intelligent thoughtful reason for supporting that clown. This debate rages in my facebook and not once have I seen a Trump supporter ever give a thoughtful reason why they support that loon. Always comes down to crooked Hillary, or loony leftie, or communist, or socialist etc. Which is fine, even in Canada we have to cut off our nose to spite our face when it comes to voting. Often we have to vote against someone rather than for someone. But I think it was clear from the get go and for about a decade where and what the Donald was planning to do and why. So it would seem to an outsider looking in that you may have set your house on fire to fix your water leak. Finally, back to healthcare, because some people like pictures, here is a Canadian Doctor testifying at an American Senate hearing.
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Post by paulus on Sept 2, 2017 7:31:15 GMT -5
Steve has it right in that middle passage. In socialist countries you pay a higher single payment, called tax, and get all the following comprehensively taken care of;
Healthcare
Education
Child Care
Retirement
Senior Care
Sick leave
Parental leave
Special needs & circumstances
etc.
In a low tax system - the individual has to make up the shortfall in all those areas. So they actually end up paying more than the higher tax system.
The low tax systems work fine for the 10% that can afford it easily. It's much less good for the following 50% where these costs bite. And it's terrible for the bottom 40% that can't actually afford them...
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Post by pingzing on Sept 2, 2017 8:36:46 GMT -5
History keeps repeating despite ancient lessons
Ancient civilisations collapsed mainly because they squandered their natural resources on opulence for the few
greed.power and ego`s to boot.
There is no greater example of that egypt and many other places around the world
also show the same decadence but on a smaller scale.
In every civilisation small or large, religions was the main tool used by greedy humans who wanted it all
we still havent learned our lessons from the past at all.
Civilisations have been toppling all over the world ever since they were invented
people scrambling for the top and survival just like ww2... for power and their individual beliefs
What are worthless species we can be at times,take,take and take
the rich get richer and the poor get the picture
I practice buddhism and yoga and wouldnt heart anyone but man other people in this world- i just dont get them in all walks of life, i havent watched the news on tv for 20 years just cant fill my head with all the crap that goes on around the world, i meditate and block all this rubbsih out- Serenity now , radio and paper is even too much for me as it as.
Fanatics and their religios belief- huh what about love and peace for all brothers and sisters- never will happen
This world today is greedy, and take, take , take every one wants something from you
I want the old days back so badly, and be off with imperialism,Communists and dictators for a start
More power to the people and get rid of many politiciains who are yes around for the money and all the perks that go with it
I thought Donny boy was going to get things done-TCB for his beloved usa ?
That`ll do me for now, time to chill out, happy festivus and serenity now
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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2017 10:34:10 GMT -5
I said I would not post again in this but I want to make a couple things clear.
I never even cared about politics till Obama got elected when I was around 32. In the industry I am in it is heavily regulated but without it everything you use from your car to the airplane you fly in would fall apart. Yes there needs to be some regulations but Democrats tend to go to the extreme with environmental issues but heavily rely on the very things the want to regulate to death. It makes me laugh to think they are legislating bills for less carbon and pollution when they are flying around in a private airplane. That without the very industry they want to strangle would fall out if the sky and the whole economy would fail. Then the health care thing didn't help. For those of you that don't run small business you have no idea the amount of strain that puts on a company. I was paying at one point 1900 a month for my head salesman and his wife got pregnant and his costs were through the roof. So what ended up happening is he had to take another job with a bigger company with better insurance. So I lost him because I could not compete with the insurance being a small business.
It is very complex and an emotional issue but a lot of people who voted for Trump did because they did not want 4 more years of Obama and the only other option was Trump. If you really think about he is exactly like Obama in the fact he won because he was something different/new and exciting for a lot of people. Most people did not vote for him because they are racist, homophobic, sexiest etc... They did because there was no alternative.
If he delivers on taxes and healthcare is yet to be seen. If we could just lower the capital gain and payroll taxes that alone will help small businesses tremendously.I framed a check and put in my basement. It is from the government for 32.28 from 7 years ago. It is the only time I have got money from the government since I was in my 20 s for a government loan for school.
End of the day I wish we could have a party that takes religion out of politics and leans towards the middle in social issues and gives a @!$# about small business and I would vote for them every time. Our fore father's vision for this country was amazing. What insight they had. The one thing they missed though is that anyone would want to make politics a carreer. This whole notion that you could get wealthy being in government was not what they had in mind when they committed treason signing the Declaration Of Independence.
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Post by Errol1967 on Sept 2, 2017 12:10:05 GMT -5
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Post by Griz891 on Sept 2, 2017 19:46:49 GMT -5
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Post by Errol1967 on Sept 3, 2017 4:32:18 GMT -5
 They look almost the same...both are stupid! |
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Post by nevadaballin on Sept 3, 2017 15:26:11 GMT -5
I said I would not post again in this but I want to make a couple things clear. I never even cared about politics till Obama got elected when I was around 32. In the industry I am in it is heavily regulated but without it everything you use from your car to the airplane you fly in would fall apart. Yes there needs to be some regulations but Democrats tend to go to the extreme with environmental issues but heavily rely on the very things the want to regulate to death. It makes me laugh to think they are legislating bills for less carbon and pollution when they are flying around in a private airplane. That without the very industry they want to strangle would fall out if the sky and the whole economy would fail. Then the health care thing didn't help. For those of you that don't run small business you have no idea the amount of strain that puts on a company. I was paying at one point 1900 a month for my head salesman and his wife got pregnant and his costs were through the roof. So what ended up happening is he had to take another job with a bigger company with better insurance. So I lost him because I could not compete with the insurance being a small business. It is very complex and an emotional issue but a lot of people who voted for Trump did because they did not want 4 more years of Obama and the only other option was Trump. If you really think about he is exactly like Obama in the fact he won because he was something different/new and exciting for a lot of people. Most people did not vote for him because they are racist, homophobic, sexiest etc... They did because there was no alternative. If he delivers on taxes and healthcare is yet to be seen. If we could just lower the capital gain and payroll taxes that alone will help small businesses tremendously.I framed a check and put in my basement. It is from the government for 32.28 from 7 years ago. It is the only time I have got money from the government since I was in my 20 s for a government loan for school. End of the day I wish we could have a party that takes religion out of politics and leans towards the middle in social issues and gives a @!$# about small business and I would vote for them every time. Our fore father's vision for this country was amazing. What insight they had. The one thing they missed though is that anyone would want to make politics a carreer. This whole notion that you could get wealthy being in government was not what they had in mind when they committed treason signing the Declaration Of Independence. I'm curious, and I don't know the answer, I'll try to research later but maybe someone in here knows - when was the last time a regulation killed an entire industry? |
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Post by paulus on Sept 3, 2017 16:35:29 GMT -5
I don't think you'll find an example of an entire industry killed by regulation - it's an over-stated argument by big business for obvious reasons - there is much profit to be had in cutting corners, putting people and the environment at risk.
For sure there will be many cases of businesses going under because of regulation. These are unfortunate and do have human cost, which is always sad. But this is one of those things that you need to consider at a macro level.
Current studies support the idea that regulation *can* cost a very small number of jobs in the industry targeted. But even for very aggressive regulation, these are still small - typically 2-3%. And these small losses are always balanced by gains in employment across other industries.
Regulation doesn't cost jobs, it redistributes them - which is a sign they're working!
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Post by nevadaballin on Sept 5, 2017 13:58:03 GMT -5
We'll see what is left of Congress's degenerating spine with this DACA decision.
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Post by paulus on Sept 5, 2017 15:47:10 GMT -5
There's a spine there? Must have missed that....
The worst of it - DACA appears to be a genuinely helpful programme on both sides - good for the individuals & good for the state. 96% are employed or in school - ie they are contributing, or in training to contribute.
Seems the only reason it's going is because it had Obama's name on it...
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Post by nevadaballin on Sept 5, 2017 18:43:55 GMT -5
There's a spine there? Must have missed that.... The worst of it - DACA appears to be a genuinely helpful programme on both sides - good for the individuals & good for the state. 96% are employed or in school - ie they are contributing, or in training to contribute. Seems the only reason it's going is because it had Obama's name on it... It goes back way before Obama. Not fixing immigration is a great way to raise campaign money every election cycle. It's a money-raising war cry on all sides. But they will never really address it because the present broken system works for people running for office. Pretty much talk about it (tell your base what they want to hear/lip service them), take the money, don't fix anything and blame the other side for it, then run on it again next election. |
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Post by mtsalmela80 on Sept 5, 2017 20:28:44 GMT -5
FRSTDWN Shall we put an end to the belief by Americans that the Canadian Healthcare system is broken. It is far from broken. The wait list argument, yes there is a wait list, but only those who can wait, wait. All Canadians know other Canadians who have received life saving operations within hours of entering the system. Yeah, things like knee replacement, yeah you have to wait, there is not thousands of doctors standing around to do knee replacement surgeries. Canadians flocking to the US for healthcare. Well, some Canadians like some Americans believe you will get better care if you pay for it versus not paying for it. However flocking is vastly over stated. The Canadian healthcare system currently treats more Americans then American systems treating Canadians to a factor of 5 to 1. Another fact that largely gets ignored by Americans, that I find curious and would like someones opinion on the opposite side. Presently I pay taxes, yeah some may say to much tax, fine whatever, not my point here. My taxes are used to provide my free healthcare among about a million other things. The government puts whatever amount of billions of dollars into the healthcare system. Break those numbers down into a per Canadian into whatever amount you get. Now Americans also pay taxes, some pay extra for Health Insurance, some get it through work, some just rely on Emergency care. Now the American Government also pays whatever billions of dollars into the Healthcare system to provide for senior care, emergency care etc. But if you were to break down those numbers to dollars per American, the American Government spends more tax dollars per American than the Canadian Governments spend per Canadian. OK tried to condense that, hope that makes sense. But, my question. How can that possibly be OK. You spend enough tax dollars already to pay for everyone, if you take profit out of the system, why not support a single payer system? Also, thank you FRSTDWN For the first time ever, I see an intelligent thoughtful reason for supporting that clown. This debate rages in my facebook and not once have I seen a Trump supporter ever give a thoughtful reason why they support that loon. Always comes down to crooked Hillary, or loony leftie, or communist, or socialist etc. Which is fine, even in Canada we have to cut off our nose to spite our face when it comes to voting. Often we have to vote against someone rather than for someone. But I think it was clear from the get go and for about a decade where and what the Donald was planning to do and why. So it would seem to an outsider looking in that you may have set your house on fire to fix your water leak. Finally, back to healthcare, because some people like pictures, here is a Canadian Doctor testifying at an American Senate hearing. Canada does not even have 40 million people in the entire land, America has roughly 400,000,000. There is your problem. It'll never work, especially because lawyers and the insurance industry are the real power players in the medicine fields. |
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Post by joegolferg on Sept 6, 2017 13:12:25 GMT -5
FRSTDWN Shall we put an end to the belief by Americans that the Canadian Healthcare system is broken. It is far from broken. The wait list argument, yes there is a wait list, but only those who can wait, wait. All Canadians know other Canadians who have received life saving operations within hours of entering the system. Yeah, things like knee replacement, yeah you have to wait, there is not thousands of doctors standing around to do knee replacement surgeries. Canadians flocking to the US for healthcare. Well, some Canadians like some Americans believe you will get better care if you pay for it versus not paying for it. However flocking is vastly over stated. The Canadian healthcare system currently treats more Americans then American systems treating Canadians to a factor of 5 to 1. Another fact that largely gets ignored by Americans, that I find curious and would like someones opinion on the opposite side. Presently I pay taxes, yeah some may say to much tax, fine whatever, not my point here. My taxes are used to provide my free healthcare among about a million other things. The government puts whatever amount of billions of dollars into the healthcare system. Break those numbers down into a per Canadian into whatever amount you get. Now Americans also pay taxes, some pay extra for Health Insurance, some get it through work, some just rely on Emergency care. Now the American Government also pays whatever billions of dollars into the Healthcare system to provide for senior care, emergency care etc. But if you were to break down those numbers to dollars per American, the American Government spends more tax dollars per American than the Canadian Governments spend per Canadian. OK tried to condense that, hope that makes sense. But, my question. How can that possibly be OK. You spend enough tax dollars already to pay for everyone, if you take profit out of the system, why not support a single payer system? Also, thank you FRSTDWN For the first time ever, I see an intelligent thoughtful reason for supporting that clown. This debate rages in my facebook and not once have I seen a Trump supporter ever give a thoughtful reason why they support that loon. Always comes down to crooked Hillary, or loony leftie, or communist, or socialist etc. Which is fine, even in Canada we have to cut off our nose to spite our face when it comes to voting. Often we have to vote against someone rather than for someone. But I think it was clear from the get go and for about a decade where and what the Donald was planning to do and why. So it would seem to an outsider looking in that you may have set your house on fire to fix your water leak. Finally, back to healthcare, because some people like pictures, here is a Canadian Doctor testifying at an American Senate hearing. Canada does not even have 40 million people in the entire land, America has roughly 400,000,000. There is your problem. It'll never work, especially because lawyers and the insurance industry are the real power players in the medicine fields. You don't have to allow the big corps to run your country you know? You can take it back from the profiteers. On your mention of the population you could argue that the more people you have the more tax money you have to put into the system. |
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