Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Jun 28, 2017 8:32:15 GMT -5
I am also finding this... Easily under par with Player clubs while struggle to get under with tour.. although now that I've got my swing timed.. I should go back to tour and check it out. The timing window is FAR stricter on Tour. IMO this is the hardest part of the new swing, coming through with 'perfect' speed. I think this comes down to the user largely and next, the device they use (which controller/mouse) they use. I find the tempo part not so bad to be honest. Once I figured out that the Slow downswing was due to pausing at the top, even just a little, P/P is about 8+ out of every 10 shots. But it took many hours for me to mange outright duckhooks/shanks into ""just" moderate draws with occasional larger hooks. |
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Post by Moe Slorkman on Jun 28, 2017 8:41:18 GMT -5
Don't know what all the fuss is about I haven't hit a single bad shot with the tour set!!!!!
Actually I haven't hit a single shot @!$# you HB, MG and Kyne you Traitor !!!!
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Post by beamstas on Jun 28, 2017 8:43:57 GMT -5
I am not really qualified to answer as iv only played tour but... dont make tour swing easier.. the variation is what will make the game fun/challenging... sure people playing on players or standard clubs could hit straight but tgc tours should be using tour clubs to add some variation to the game. I just played my first society tournament in tastegw society and shot -2 using tour including a sculled flop out of the bunker into water for a 7 on a par 5. Its good distasters like that can happen if you are not careful
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Post by koolie_g on Jun 28, 2017 8:49:04 GMT -5
The Tour Clubs and the new swing mechanic are total game changers. I'm in the Tour Club should be mandatory for the top tours camp. I've not been able to break par with Tour Clubs yet, but I've only played about 3 rounds. I was dead on with Player clubs thru 9 holes, so I switched back to the tour clubs. It seems that although people have complained about TGC1 scores being too low and unrealistic, they didn't REALLY want it to mimic real golf where you can't just dial in every shot and there is a risk for trying to hit a 15 yard wide fairway near water. The hazards on TGC1 hardly ever came into play for most top players. With the Tour Clubs the entire course is in play. Player Clubs offer too much control. I don't think you can have true competitive tourneys with different difficulty levels. The penalties for poor swings with Tour Clubs is too much to overcome for those that don't have to worry about missing fairways and greens. Lengthening courses to crazy yardages is not needed, just say people have to play on the highest difficulty if they want to be in the PGA/Euro. If they don't want to play on the highest difficulty, they can play on another Tour. No one is entitled to play on any certain Tour. This is why a whole new reset of WGR might be a good idea. Just because you were good at TGC1 has little to do with how good you might be at TGC2 it appears.
I apparently have a natural draw that borders on a hook. I can account for that on most swings, but it's just an approximation. And sometimes I hit it straight and then I'm screwed there. I'm sure we will all get better with Tour Clubs in a few weeks. The TGC guys having early access knew this was gonna be a HUGE adjustment for almost everyone, and kudus to them for suspended the tours for a few weeks so everyone could iron what we would need to do. This game looks great and I'm looking forward to getting better.
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Post by HeMan1202 on Jun 28, 2017 8:51:40 GMT -5
I am not really qualified to answer as iv only played tour but... dont make tour swing easier.. the variation is what will make the game fun/challenging... sure people playing on players or standard clubs could hit straight but tgc tours should be using tour clubs to add some variation to the game. I just played my first society tournament in tastegw society and shot -2 using tour including a sculled flop out of the bunker into water for a 7 on a par 5. Its good distasters like that can happen if you are not careful I agree to not making it easier other than toning down the duck hooks for a fast downswing. It should tug left but not that much. I like the fact that the higher the club the more penalizing, that part is spot on. The line between a perfect/perfect and a perfect/fast is very small. Just tone down the extreme duck hooks.
If you're a fan of golf SIM, I don't see how you're not using the Tour club set.
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Post by mde8965 on Jun 28, 2017 9:06:30 GMT -5
I am not really qualified to answer as iv only played tour but... dont make tour swing easier.. the variation is what will make the game fun/challenging... sure people playing on players or standard clubs could hit straight but tgc tours should be using tour clubs to add some variation to the game. I just played my first society tournament in tastegw society and shot -2 using tour including a sculled flop out of the bunker into water for a 7 on a par 5. Its good distasters like that can happen if you are not careful I agree to not making it easier other than toning down the duck hooks for a fast downswing. It should tug left but not that much. I like the fact that the higher the club the more penalizing, that part is spot on. The line between a perfect/perfect and a perfect/fast is very small. Just tone down the extreme duck hooks.
If you're a fan of golf SIM, I don't see how you're not using the Tour club set.
Guessing everyone would want to master the tour clubs. But right now though guessing people trying to figure out the whole tempo thing...and messing around between player and tour clubs trying to balance the need (for themselves) to have fun (using tour clubs - and being inconsistent) and trying to ensure they can be competitive in TGC2 once things get going again (using player clubs to improve scoring chances).
I believe Doyley already said there is no way for them to police the use of Tour clubs in tournaments. But even if they should add that option in game when setting up tournaments, I am of the belief that they will NOT enforce use of tour clubs, but that there will be tweaks in the swing mechanics that come out as game patches that reduce the massive hooks/slices just a bit with tour clubs, and kill the distance more with player clubs until there is more of a clear risk reward scenario between the two. And then people will naturally gravitate. The best of the best will do so with tour clubs. The mid-packers in the pro tours will stick with the player clubs because they feel they are still too inconsistent with tour clubs, and the CC tours will have a combination of all three club choices.
In short, I just feel right now, too much of a risk for tour clubs compared to player. Rectify that, either by toning down hook/slice a little bit (not much) nd by reducing distances on player clubs even more...and then the debate will not be a debate. Use whatever you want.
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Post by rustydynamite on Jun 28, 2017 9:06:33 GMT -5
Tour vs. Player clubs. A little too much difference in the two. Change the Tour club setting to punish distance more and hook/slice less on off tempo shots. And a bit less on hook/slice regardless of tempo. Duck hooks and 90 degree slices should not be THAT prevalent. Agreed. Off tempo should be punished by loss of distance on anything not a wedge, like hitting a shot fat. On wedges they should be punished by both addition and subtraction of distance because a wedge hit skinny can go a very long ways from target distance. That's what I would expect from being off tempo. Not hooks and slices, leave that up to the stick path. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 28, 2017 9:12:48 GMT -5
The Tour Clubs and the new swing mechanic are total game changers. I'm in the Tour Club should be mandatory for the top tours camp. I've not been able to break par with Tour Clubs yet, but I've only played about 3 rounds. I was dead on with Player clubs thru 9 holes, so I switched back to the tour clubs. It seems that although people have complained about TGC1 scores being too low and unrealistic, they didn't REALLY want it to mimic real golf where you can't just dial in every shot and there is a risk for trying to hit a 15 yard wide fairway near water. The hazards on TGC1 hardly ever came into play for most top players. With the Tour Clubs the entire course is in play. Player Clubs offer too much control. I don't think you can have true competitive tourneys with different difficulty levels. The penalties for poor swings with Tour Clubs is too much to overcome for those that don't have to worry about missing fairways and greens. Lengthening courses to crazy yardages is not needed, just say people have to play on the highest difficulty if they want to be in the PGA/Euro. If they don't want to play on the highest difficulty, they can play on another Tour. No one is entitled to play on any certain Tour. This is why a whole new reset of WGR might be a good idea. Just because you were good at TGC1 has little to do with how good you might be at TGC2 it appears. I apparently have a natural draw that borders on a hook. I can account for that on most swings, but it's just an approximation. And sometimes I hit it straight and then I'm screwed there. I'm sure we will all get better with Tour Clubs in a few weeks. The TGC guys having early access knew this was gonna be a HUGE adjustment for almost everyone, and kudus to them for suspended the tours for a few weeks so everyone could iron what we would need to do. This game looks great and I'm looking forward to getting better. So I haven't decided on this yet. I will be using the tour swing in official tgct events. I find a curious problem, though if enforcing one type of swing occurs no matter which or how many (short of them all) tours do that. For example, lets say it indeed becomes the way of PGA/Euro. The "border" on Web and PGA/Euro would become an interesting area. Some may simply not want to move up and pass on exemptions. This would be a new layer on top of that already existing issue. Those moving in reverse by demotions would encounter issue if they prefer Tour swing and now are in a tour where all swing types are welcomed. Highest difficulty does have its advantages with the extra distance and spin. Yes, the minuses for almost all of us outweigh the pluses. However, in the next few days there will be a few stunning scores seen that will make people go "How?" or "WTF?" etc. So do we then lock CC-Am to Standard and then Web/CC-Pro to Player? I am getting a bit off topic. I just want to be careful what can of worms gets opened if TGCT does the Tour mode for Top tours thing. A couple of points: One can't just select their tour. Your previous scoring dictates where you are. There are rules in place to keep you where you are and to move you up or down. The one caveat about forced demotions on PGA/Euro/Web is that on the actual PGA (might be so for the other two.. unsure) you earned that card for the entire season. Once we go back live, there will only be 6 events or so before end of season events occur. One of which is the Web.com Finals in which cards gets up or downgraded anyways. Same goes for the Web/CC border. So I think those enforced top tour demotions should at least be held off until Season 4. But thats a different topic. I do believe a reset of WGR is more of a time issue than a philosophical issue. If it can't be done because resources are limited, then it's a bit moot whether it should be done. I would kind of like new WGR and Q-School and possibly fighting to move up the ranks. But if it can't be done, then we have the alternatives and additional things that I am sure will be addressed and posted by staff. Don't get me wrong, I am actually mostly on your side, but I just wonder about unforseen issues that become of a change like locking in a swing difficulty/setting that may/will arise. A lot makes sense now about what we were getting hints about the last 2 months or so. I just wish the staff all the best in getting TGCTours up and ready for TGC2 in the next few weeks. A lot of work going into this I am sure. |
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bearfan3417
Weekend Golfer
Posts: 95 
TGCT Name: Logan Beilke
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Post by bearfan3417 on Jun 28, 2017 9:18:54 GMT -5
Doesn't make sense to have the top tours playing anything other than Tour clubs..
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Post by HeMan1202 on Jun 28, 2017 9:52:14 GMT -5
The Tour Clubs and the new swing mechanic are total game changers. I'm in the Tour Club should be mandatory for the top tours camp. I've not been able to break par with Tour Clubs yet, but I've only played about 3 rounds. I was dead on with Player clubs thru 9 holes, so I switched back to the tour clubs. It seems that although people have complained about TGC1 scores being too low and unrealistic, they didn't REALLY want it to mimic real golf where you can't just dial in every shot and there is a risk for trying to hit a 15 yard wide fairway near water. The hazards on TGC1 hardly ever came into play for most top players. With the Tour Clubs the entire course is in play. Player Clubs offer too much control. I don't think you can have true competitive tourneys with different difficulty levels. The penalties for poor swings with Tour Clubs is too much to overcome for those that don't have to worry about missing fairways and greens. Lengthening courses to crazy yardages is not needed, just say people have to play on the highest difficulty if they want to be in the PGA/Euro. If they don't want to play on the highest difficulty, they can play on another Tour. No one is entitled to play on any certain Tour. This is why a whole new reset of WGR might be a good idea. Just because you were good at TGC1 has little to do with how good you might be at TGC2 it appears. I apparently have a natural draw that borders on a hook. I can account for that on most swings, but it's just an approximation. And sometimes I hit it straight and then I'm screwed there. I'm sure we will all get better with Tour Clubs in a few weeks. The TGC guys having early access knew this was gonna be a HUGE adjustment for almost everyone, and kudus to them for suspended the tours for a few weeks so everyone could iron what we would need to do. This game looks great and I'm looking forward to getting better. So I haven't decided on this yet. I will be using the tour swing in official tgct events. I find a curious problem, though if enforcing one type of swing occurs no matter which or how many (short of them all) tours do that. For example, lets say it indeed becomes the way of PGA/Euro. The "border" on Web and PGA/Euro would become an interesting area. Some may simply not want to move up and pass on exemptions. This would be a new layer on top of that already existing issue. Those moving in reverse by demotions would encounter issue if they prefer Tour swing and now are in a tour where all swing types are welcomed. Highest difficulty does have its advantages with the extra distance and spin. Yes, the minuses for almost all of us outweigh the pluses. However, in the next few days there will be a few stunning scores seen that will make people go "How?" or "WTF?" etc. So do we then lock CC-Am to Standard and then Web/CC-Pro to Player? I am getting a bit off topic. I just want to be careful what can of worms gets opened if TGCT does the Tour mode for Top tours thing. A couple of points: One can't just select their tour. Your previous scoring dictates where you are. There are rules in place to keep you where you are and to move you up or down. The one caveat about forced demotions on PGA/Euro/Web is that on the actual PGA (might be so for the other two.. unsure) you earned that card for the entire season. Once we go back live, there will only be 6 events or so before end of season events occur. One of which is the Web.com Finals in which cards gets up or downgraded anyways. Same goes for the Web/CC border. So I think those enforced top tour demotions should at least be held off until Season 4. But thats a different topic. I do believe a reset of WGR is more of a time issue than a philosophical issue. If it can't be done because resources are limited, then it's a bit moot whether it should be done. I would kind of like new WGR and Q-School and possibly fighting to move up the ranks. But if it can't be done, then we have the alternatives and additional things that I am sure will be addressed and posted by staff. Don't get me wrong, I am actually mostly on your side, but I just wonder about unforseen issues that become of a change like locking in a swing difficulty/setting that may/will arise. A lot makes sense now about what we were getting hints about the last 2 months or so. I just wish the staff all the best in getting TGCTours up and ready for TGC2 in the next few weeks. A lot of work going into this I am sure. Here's a question. If I play Euro and choose to use the more difficult Tour swing but am missing cuts because half of the field is scoring better using the easier Players clubs (or even Standard), do I deserve to be demoted. Are those players really better than me at the game? I'm just saying how is it fair to compare my game against another when our difficulty settings aren't the same. And the whole "I have the option to use Players clubs too" thing is bogus. I am choosing not to play on an easier setting because I want the challenge of what IRL golf via this game, however small that might be.
This is a bigger decision for TGCT now because Societies gives everyone an alternative for competitive play. I can go find a society that is Tour only. I don't want to but that option is now there.
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JoeOP
Weekend Golfer
Posts: 128
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Post by JoeOP on Jun 28, 2017 9:54:22 GMT -5
how would the clubs be enforced? there is no option in the game to restrict club type in tourneys. im in the camp that the competitor should be able to use whatever clubs they want. the folks who master the tour clubs are going to the dominant players on tour.
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casimir
Caddy
I score my games based upon how many birdies I can turn into pars...
Posts: 53
TGCT Name: Mike Charves
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Post by casimir on Jun 28, 2017 9:57:23 GMT -5
I'm not a top level player - only in the CCAM camp - but I started playing with Tour clubs from the beginning and haven't even tried Player, let alone Standard(?). Like many others have said, I find the balance between risk/reward refreshing... every shot can be a nail biter, particularly with the more difficult courses (let alone target golf courses).
From my perspective this debate comes down to balance really. If a player using Player clubs (or Standard) doesn't really gain any advantage over one using Tour clubs, then letting players choose their clubs seems fine to me. However, if there is an advantage to be gained, then I'd be firmly in the camp of restricting club selection to make the playing field (per Tour mind you) even. From what some in this thread have suggested, it looks like the Player clubs offer such an advantage (and this is based upon comments, not experience, as I haven't used Player clubs at all).
Ultimately, my only real concern is to make sure that the competition is fair and even at each Tour level.
I admit that I do think that Tour clubs offer a much more "realistic" golf experience in TGC2 (for risk/reward), as it forces the player to consider the entire golf course and shot placement for every shot... but I also realize that not everyone is looking for that same level of risk/reward experience... and that, I think, is the real crux of the issue.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Jun 28, 2017 10:03:04 GMT -5
So I haven't decided on this yet. I will be using the tour swing in official tgct events. I find a curious problem, though if enforcing one type of swing occurs no matter which or how many (short of them all) tours do that. For example, lets say it indeed becomes the way of PGA/Euro. The "border" on Web and PGA/Euro would become an interesting area. Some may simply not want to move up and pass on exemptions. This would be a new layer on top of that already existing issue. Those moving in reverse by demotions would encounter issue if they prefer Tour swing and now are in a tour where all swing types are welcomed. Highest difficulty does have its advantages with the extra distance and spin. Yes, the minuses for almost all of us outweigh the pluses. However, in the next few days there will be a few stunning scores seen that will make people go "How?" or "WTF?" etc. So do we then lock CC-Am to Standard and then Web/CC-Pro to Player? I am getting a bit off topic. I just want to be careful what can of worms gets opened if TGCT does the Tour mode for Top tours thing. A couple of points: One can't just select their tour. Your previous scoring dictates where you are. There are rules in place to keep you where you are and to move you up or down. The one caveat about forced demotions on PGA/Euro/Web is that on the actual PGA (might be so for the other two.. unsure) you earned that card for the entire season. Once we go back live, there will only be 6 events or so before end of season events occur. One of which is the Web.com Finals in which cards gets up or downgraded anyways. Same goes for the Web/CC border. So I think those enforced top tour demotions should at least be held off until Season 4. But thats a different topic. I do believe a reset of WGR is more of a time issue than a philosophical issue. If it can't be done because resources are limited, then it's a bit moot whether it should be done. I would kind of like new WGR and Q-School and possibly fighting to move up the ranks. But if it can't be done, then we have the alternatives and additional things that I am sure will be addressed and posted by staff. Don't get me wrong, I am actually mostly on your side, but I just wonder about unforseen issues that become of a change like locking in a swing difficulty/setting that may/will arise. A lot makes sense now about what we were getting hints about the last 2 months or so. I just wish the staff all the best in getting TGCTours up and ready for TGC2 in the next few weeks. A lot of work going into this I am sure. Here's a question. If I play Euro and choose to use the more difficult Tour swing but am missing cuts because half of the field is scoring better using the easier Players clubs (or even Standard), do I deserve to be demoted. Are those players really better than me at the game? I'm just saying how is it fair to compare my game against another when our difficulty settings aren't the same. And the whole "I have the option to use Players clubs too" thing is bogus. I am choosing not to play on an easier setting because I want the challenge of what IRL golf via this game, however small that might be.
This is a bigger decision for TGCT now because Societies gives everyone an alternative for competitive play. I can go find a society that is Tour only. I don't want to but that option is now there.
Totally understand that. That is the flip side of many of my points. I've thought that side of it out, too, but just wanted to see how things will shake out in this testing phase while most of us start from day one before I got too into what ifs... even if I think what you are saying is true (a large portion of it I do), I think staff would have to see how it unfolds before acting. Tim and Scott were in the demo. I assume but not sure about fuzion, the other Scott, or Jeff. They have seen these things coming for longer than us and likely wanted to see scores and reactions in these next 2 weeks or so before deciding... but that is speculation. Making one tour enforced and the other not isn't exactly the solution that works because its more about region (and avoiding Sweeney in TGC1 for some) and location. |
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Post by Timbr0_T on Jun 28, 2017 10:03:49 GMT -5
Agreed with Tour clubs for top tours.
I would be more concerned with how different the game plays on different systems. I bought it for PS4 and PC, and it is truly a different game on Tour setting for me.
On PS4, the frame rate is so poor on some courses it is impossible to get perfect/perfect, because the golfer's backswing lags so much.
On my mid-spec gaming PC using the SAME controller, I get great FPS, perfect/perfect 90% of the time, the occasional hook from a fast downswing but generally shots are quite straight and land beautifully. As soon as I started playing on PC, I felt like I was cheating compared to PS.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 28, 2017 10:04:09 GMT -5
how would the clubs be enforced? there is no option in the game to restrict club type in tourneys. im in the camp that the competitor should be able to use whatever clubs they want. the folks who master the tour clubs are going to the dominant players on tour. I believe somewhere Doyley mentioned seeing the returns from the test events in the Societies to see if it is included in the API data. Kind of like how they check for dead straight shooters. |
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