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Post by SweetTeeBag on Dec 23, 2014 8:19:18 GMT -5
I am not here to knock anybody's courses but will we be playing any tournaments with 4 round scores which the Top score will be only around -10 or majors where Even takes the win?
With Q school being considered hard and seeing guys shot -60/-50 under is a bit unrealistic in my opinion.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 23, 2014 8:57:37 GMT -5
Do you have any suggestions for courses?
The reason I ask, it's a ton of work to put together a course, never mind the creativity required, however to put together a course to hold scores down will guarantee it to be destined for complete obscurity.
The original Copper Creek used to eat me before it was requested to be changed as there were, I'm assuming, a few complaints, but even the original Jim shot -17.
Son gual still gets scores in the 50's as did Kodiak.
I'd be interested to see a course, that held Doyley to close to even par. I would hazard a guess it would need to be a desert course with no fairways or greens.
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Post by SweetTeeBag on Dec 23, 2014 9:04:10 GMT -5
Do you have any suggestions for courses? The reason I ask, it's a ton of work to put together a course, never mind the creativity required, however to put together a course to hold scores down will guarantee it to be destined for complete obscurity. The original Copper Creek used to eat me before it was requested to be changed as there were, I'm assuming, a few complaints, but even the original Jim shot -17. Son gual still gets scores in the 50's as did Kodiak. I'd be interested to see a course, that held Doyley to close to even par. I would hazard a guess it would need to be a desert course with no fairways or greens. It's like we need 230 yard par 3's, 480-500 par 4's and 700 yard par 5's for someone to shoot close to Even I think. I would not say do this very often obviously but Majors should be extremely difficult. The scores we are seeing are ala Tiger Woods and this is supposed to be a realistic sim. I have not even touched the Greg Norman course creator but may do so this week to see what I can come up and I know this will take some time. I played Gregors Firth V2 and last I checked the top score was like -2 I think |
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Post by SmilingGoats on Dec 23, 2014 9:06:49 GMT -5
We're going to be playing a variety of courses. Some weeks will be challenging and some weeks not as much. Variety is the spice of life, as they say.
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Post by SweetTeeBag on Dec 23, 2014 9:08:38 GMT -5
We're going to be playing a variety of courses. Some weeks will be challenging and some weeks not as much. Variety is the spice of life, as they say. Sure I understand. But if you look at the TOC I am sure somebody who wins this will shoot -50 for 4 rounds, no doubt in my mind. Does that normally happen on the PGA Tour for 4 rounds? |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 23, 2014 9:10:31 GMT -5
it aint worth making a course nobody will want to play
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Post by SmilingGoats on Dec 23, 2014 9:12:06 GMT -5
I hear what you're saying but I don't think we're going to be able to do much about that. The game is what it is. We can try to simulate real life as much as possible but at some point, the reality is that this is still a video game.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 23, 2014 9:16:58 GMT -5
no, everybody doesnt want to shoot -12.
but they do want to play on a fun course, regardless of score.
230/500/700 all day is a snooze fest.
edit: this response was to a post that is no longer there....
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Post by SweetTeeBag on Dec 23, 2014 9:26:13 GMT -5
no, everybody doesnt want to shoot -12. but they do want to play on a fun course, regardless of score. 230/500/700 all day is a snooze fest. edit: this response was to a post that is no longer there.... I just want majors to be hard. I understand this is a game but I think the majors need to be a step above the rest with realistic scores throughout. I can't believe I am in the minority on this. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 23, 2014 9:30:37 GMT -5
no, everybody doesnt want to shoot -12. but they do want to play on a fun course, regardless of score. 230/500/700 all day is a snooze fest. edit: this response was to a post that is no longer there.... I just want majors to be hard. I understand this is a game but I think the majors need to be a step above the rest with realistic scores throughout. I can't believe I am in the minority on this. you are not in the minority, you are just asking for the wrong type of course. course doesnt need to be a million yards long to be hard. but increased speeds is the other route, and the majority of the players hate them, even if the greens hold. you will not see me producing any more really firm courses with fast greens, did you see kodiaks rating? tgc 4.5, but in game on pc, 5.2 out of 10 |
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Post by dlw1964 on Dec 23, 2014 9:31:02 GMT -5
Not going to work.
You set up a course to bring top players score down then what type of scores do you think the rest of the players are going to shot.
I hate firm greens , don't like heavy winds but this doesn't mean I can't play them. (There just not fun)
Personally I think the harder the course the more it favors the top players.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 23, 2014 9:32:34 GMT -5
I believe I live close to Doyley, for the right price I can take care of his thumbs.
"230/500/700 all day is a snooze fest." And not enough.
However I have had this debate a million times, it always comes down to raise the other guys scores leave mine alone. The OP is a good player, not suggesting this is the case for him. However WGT went down this road and made a bad game worse. They brought in a magical force that effected most but not all. That's the only way to go, but a very bad way to go. I know I would never darken their doors again.
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Post by SweetTeeBag on Dec 23, 2014 9:36:59 GMT -5
Here is a list of the lowest 72-hole scores in relation to par.
33 -- Steve Stricker*, 2009 Bob Hope Classic, 255, four courses, par 72 (T3)
31 -- Ernie Els, 2003 Mercedes Championship, 261, par 73 (won)
30 -- Pat Perez*, 2009 Bob Hope Classic, 258, four courses, par 72 (won)
29 -- Joe Durant*, 2001 Bob Hope Chrysler Classic, 259, four courses, par 72 (won); Tim Herron*, 2003 Bob Hope Chrysler Classic, 259, four courses, par 72 (T3)
28 -- John Huston, 1998 United Airlines Hawaiian Open, 260, par 72 (won); Mark Calcavecchia, 2001 Phoenix Open, 256, par 71 (won); Stuart Appleby*, 2003 Las Vegas Invitational, 259, three courses (TPC Summerlin/par 72, TPC The Canyons/par 71, Southern Highlands/par 72) (won); Phil Mickelson, 2006 BellSouth Classic, 260, par 72 (won); Phil Mickelson, 2013 Waste Management Phoenix Open, 256, par 71 (won); Patrick Reed, 2014 Humana Challenge, 260, par 72 (won)
* -- Through first four rounds of 90-hole tournament
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Post by NCFCRulz on Dec 23, 2014 9:41:14 GMT -5
I really don't mind whether we play rounds with big scores or not! I like the realistic idea but the bottom line is the best players on here are better than the best real life players and that causes an issue!
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Post by jwfickett on Dec 23, 2014 9:43:22 GMT -5
I'm going through the process of selecting the early courses now. I selected Ascension Bay, what I consider to be a tough but still semi-realistic golf course (obviously this one is closer to fantasy due to the elevation changes, but still). Guys are molesting it. I'm sure the scores would be closer to even if it was a full field event, but the winners each week on the PGA Tour and probably the European Tour as well are going to be below -40. There's nothing we can do about it. -62 won Q-school on 5 brutal courses and 1 hard course. There is just no way we are ever going to see realistic scores on a golf video game. You can't recreate the complexity of the full body motion of a golf swing in the flick of a thumb. The mechanics don't equate. So we are where we are, and I'm not going to pick courses that alienate 3/4s of the field to try to challenge the top 1/4. I'm going to pick a wide variety of courses, with varying degrees of difficulty, theme, style, and course management requirements, to try to give everyone a few tournaments that play to their strengths, while trying to simulate the same criteria on the week's real-life counterpart.
So yes, the majors will be tough. The US Open course is going to be a beast (close to what the OP wants...probably a 7400 yard par 70, and I'd venture to guess that -25 or -30 still wins) but the John Deere Classic course is going to be something where scores are going to be low. It's the best I can do.
TL;DR Summary:
Courses will be picked based on how much people enjoy playing them. If everyone ragequits, the tours die.
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