adro
Caddy
Posts: 10
Tour: CC-Pro
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Post by adro on Apr 25, 2019 3:21:33 GMT -5
how does the API work? if its staying in the blue line then i've got nothing to worry about most my shots are outside of the line
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Post by mart280 on Apr 26, 2019 19:07:46 GMT -5
I think the answer is to ban controllers and everyone has to play with a mouse
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Post by Brighttail on Apr 26, 2019 19:30:28 GMT -5
A few thoughts:
1. I can understand why the Admin choose not to get into the weeds about the API info and the system that causes a round to be specifically pulled, outside the instructions of, "too many straight shots", "not enough shot dispersion" or "too many repetitive, clustered shots". In this case too much detailed information can lead people, not just those who had their round pulled, to work out a way to skirt the API.
2. I can only speak from a mouse perspective but I have had people come to me who have had their scores pulled. The number 1 issue is their DPI is too low. I used, prior to the current TGC game, to suggest a minimum of 800 DPI because after a LOT of testing with Jeff we found that 800 was not only HB's suggested setting but it was a setting that pretty much ensured that even if you had a great ball striking round, you wouldn't fail the API. The problem is some people took this as meaning, if 800 is pretty much guaranteed not to fail and this person was using 400, then at 450 or 500 they might just scrape by the API. In essence they might be right but for me that was the wrong mindset. I liken it to some people I have known who are in the middle of a good round, think that they might be hitting it too straight and intentionally try to hit a few bad shots to offset their really good shots. Basically instead of trying a setting that people can play with that will be fully legitimate, they try to push the envelope and create an advantage for themselves. The problem is, it is very hard for the Admin to distinguish a person who is legitimately trying to fix their swing and a person who is trying to push that line.
My overall experience from some 25-30 people over the years who have come to me for help with their mouse swing is that what I mentioned above is a small number, like 2 or 3 people who I think were trying to push that line. The rest were people who either had an older mouse with a hard set DPI, a software that enabled angle snapping ON by default or just started playing and found that a really low DPI helped them score well. These last people honestly had no idea the relation DPI had to the swing and once they did, fixed the issue properly.
Overall, I'd hate to see someone who is honestly trying to fix a problem be banned when their intent is legit. I think that admin have done a good job at identifying people this season as people who were trying to game the system. That is the nice thing about the API data is it is a history of how we play the game and when an Admin sees a flagged person suddenly hitting short shots/putts straight or see particular, crucial shots being straighter than normal, they take notice. Then if they feel that the person has either had multiple chances or at least should know better, they pulled the season ban trigger.
I say all this as a person who once too was ignorant of the effect DPI, angle snapping and various mouse settings had on my swing and I spent a long, long time trying to overcome the demands that I be banned for life because I was originally arrogant that I was so good with my swing on the forums, then humbled because I found out on my own I had an advantage and had no idea why. I too reworked my swing after that but just the fact of me being a mouse user who had the ABILITY to create advantages using various settings, overshadowed the fact I didn't have, and still never have had a round pulled by the admin. In fact there was a movement to ban all mouse players because we all had this ability. That seems so long ago and the fact I'm seeing the same arguments, disputes and anger with controller users, I must admit, does have me chuckling to myself at times. Who would have thought that in the end the admin would have had more headaches with controllers than mice?
Anyway my point is this...it is so very hard to distinguish intent. So no, I don't like the idea of automatic bans for someone who fails multiple APIs in a particular amount of time. The admin are pretty good at what they do and are best suited to figuring out the patterns. I don't think we need a set of rules to enforce that which they are already trying to do.
Now chipping on the greens under 100 feet? How the heck is Brad not DQ'd for doing so at 99 feet already? I'm fully open to reconsidering the current rule of 100ft no chippie...
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Post by GW_Hope on Apr 26, 2019 19:57:40 GMT -5
I agree, I don’t like bans if at all possible. But some sort of fine (points) seems reasonable as a deterrent and motivation to correct. As for Brad, 1 stroke penalty. That’s what that extra putt cost me! But seriously I don’t even care. I just like his honesty.
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Post by Brighttail on Apr 26, 2019 20:14:45 GMT -5
I agree, I don’t like bans if at all possible. But some sort of fine (points) seems reasonable as a deterrent and motivation to correct. As for Brad, 1 stroke penalty. That’s what that extra putt cost me! But seriously I don’t even care. I just like his honesty. Yeah he didn't have to tell anyone and no one would have known. I'm not sure the 1 stroke penalty tho, the rule is the rule and Doyley loves that rule. I know I have been fighting with him on it for 5 years now. I'm wearing him down !!
Seriously tho if anything I hope it proves the point I've been saying, there are times you simply cannot under the conditions, get to the hole with max power. That is a flaw in the game in my opinion. If this were St. Andrews on the PGA, Mickelson would have chipped.
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Post by fadgewacker on Apr 30, 2019 16:55:40 GMT -5
I agree, I don’t like bans if at all possible. But some sort of fine (points) seems reasonable as a deterrent and motivation to correct. As for Brad, 1 stroke penalty. That’s what that extra putt cost me! But seriously I don’t even care. I just like his honesty. Yeah he didn't have to tell anyone and no one would have known. I'm not sure the 1 stroke penalty tho, the rule is the rule and Doyley loves that rule. I know I have been fighting with him on it for 5 years now. I'm wearing him down !!
Seriously tho if anything I hope it proves the point I've been saying, there are times you simply cannot under the conditions, get to the hole with max power. That is a flaw in the game in my opinion. If this were St. Andrews on the PGA, Mickelson would have chipped. and if it hadn't have got up the slope, he'd have ran up and hit it again before it stopped moving.
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NinjaMonkeyIII
Weekend Golfer
Posts: 113
TGCT Name: Steve Galletta
Tour: European
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Post by NinjaMonkeyIII on May 3, 2019 10:28:33 GMT -5
IMHO if you fail more than once something is not right somewhere. There shouldn't be an issue if your using a stock ps4 or xbox controller. I think anyone who has more than 2 and up to 3,4 flags should just be banned for the year and reapply following season
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Post by Brighttail on May 3, 2019 17:50:41 GMT -5
IMHO if you fail more than once something is not right somewhere. There shouldn't be an issue if your using a stock ps4 or xbox controller. I think anyone who has more than 2 and up to 3,4 flags should just be banned for the year and reapply following season Sadly you are incorrect here. Even stock controllers have issues, can wear out and have dead spots.
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NinjaMonkeyIII
Weekend Golfer
Posts: 113
TGCT Name: Steve Galletta
Tour: European
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Post by NinjaMonkeyIII on May 3, 2019 17:53:20 GMT -5
IMHO if you fail more than once something is not right somewhere. There shouldn't be an issue if your using a stock ps4 or xbox controller. I think anyone who has more than 2 and up to 3,4 flags should just be banned for the year and reapply following season Sadly you are incorrect here. Even stock controllers have issues, can wear out and have dead spots. Very true , but if after the 2nd time you would think that issue might have been addressed already or certainly should have been considered
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Post by fadgewacker on May 3, 2019 18:11:42 GMT -5
IMHO if you fail more than once something is not right somewhere. There shouldn't be an issue if your using a stock ps4 or xbox controller. I think anyone who has more than 2 and up to 3,4 flags should just be banned for the year and reapply following season Sadly you are incorrect here. Even stock controllers have issues, can wear out and have dead spots. If your controller is wrecked, you change it. You will not have another one wear out in the season. Let alone 5 times.
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NinjaMonkeyIII
Weekend Golfer
Posts: 113
TGCT Name: Steve Galletta
Tour: European
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Post by NinjaMonkeyIII on May 3, 2019 18:15:18 GMT -5
Sadly you are incorrect here. Even stock controllers have issues, can wear out and have dead spots. If your controller is wrecked, you change it. You will not have another one wear out in the season. Let alone 5 times. I mean if I’m facing 3,4,5 api fails not only should I be given a timeout by commish heck I would give myself a timeout . The game is hard enough but to worry about tee’ing off each week and passing api I would lose all my hair ,lol
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