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Post by Deleted on Dec 8, 2018 0:58:33 GMT -5
Put a post with link in shoutout box when you are going live. Have you played your rounds for TGC Tours live with this over the should view with a DS4 controller? Also do a scan of your PS4 to show no Titan One attached to it. If all looks good I would have to think if you were to even get these 18x of the same set value the admins would have no choice to let your scores pass and put all the doubters to rest. . I don't think there's any doubt that he's playing legit, and he has shown in another vid that he has no weird stuff attached. Fadge was flagged for the same reason a few weeks back, as were Bob and Brad just before the season started - it's not cheating and it's not fair to insinuate that there's foul play going on with a Titan or whatever. It's very obvious he's a hardcore flicker and is extremely good at it (other flickers aren't quite as good and so don't get flagged but still get the same results, that's the other aspect of this debate!) Regarding admins having no choice but to pass if they witness him playing, that wouldn't happen because that's not how the fair play system works - it's not about cheating as such, it's about ensuring a level playing field by requiring a minimum level of difficulty for everyone playing the game. If your api results are superior to that minimal level of difficulty, then you get flagged whether you're legit or not. It's like the debate about allowing male-to-female transsexual athletes to compete against females - they've had surgery and are legally female, but their testosterone levels are effectively the same as a female using massive quantities of steroids. So basically, good flickers in TGCT are thick-necked post-op trannies oozing testosterone It's not their fault, they didn't take steroids, but if the rules state that certain testosterone levels result in disqualification due to the unfair advantage, then they get DQ'd.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 8, 2018 1:17:41 GMT -5
The flick isn't illegal...but if you're allowing the controller springs to keep your swing on axis, it isn't a natural swing movement and therefore it is likely to produce unnatural results. And if you get flagged for it, then you've made your bed. Live with the consequences. It's not like all of us can choose to use that swing method. It simply doesn't work on PC. This is true from what I have read. I didn't clarify, so my bad.
What I meant is among the PS4 users (who I was speaking of with the "can't" remark). Quick, angry posts from work never go over well for me.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 8, 2018 1:20:46 GMT -5
Completely different. “Flicking” is a method of swinging using the standard equipment. Anchoring is modifying the equipment allowed. But it still creates potential advantages, such as making the stroke simpler and more repeatable. So who goes around to everyone's places around the world to police this?
Right, impossible.
So back to the API.
They (here) make it more stringent and I get flagged then I accept it, and then I move on to learn a new swing and look at using a different DS4(s). Pretty much what I told myself before the season started.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 8, 2018 1:22:19 GMT -5
The flick isn't illegal...but if you're allowing the controller springs to keep your swing on axis, it isn't a natural swing movement and therefore it is likely to produce unnatural results. And if you get flagged for it, then you've made your bed. Live with the consequences. It's not like all of us can choose to use that swing method. It simply doesn't work on PC. You might have missed my question, is letting go of the stick after it hits the front plastic part of the controller, can't go further than that, is considred "flicking"? Silly question, why can't it work on a PC? Can't you use a Xbox or a DS4 on them instead of a mouse? I think the way the inputs are sent or read are different on PS4 as it doesn't seem to be possible on PC even with a DS4. This is all anecdotal, of course, from reading these boards as I don't read the clown's mouth stuff over at HB's site.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 8, 2018 1:26:17 GMT -5
Cyclerob, here is the swing video I promised. Pretty simple to get a full line and no issues. I promise no Snuggie images either! FIXED I think This is not your guy’s fault it’s on HB for changing the programming of the swing line. I am merely.showing how you can swing a full line and avoid some api issues .It's not hard to do. Just hold on to the analog longer and/or don't let go so early.
Just remember... Back in TGC1 when a decent % of the PS4 user base was caught up in the "swinggate" they put out something similar, almost in a mocking manner of how "simple" it is to do. What they didn't have are people who naturally swing with a light touch. That is what caused those non-swings.
Also, just like it may be simple to you and it is difficult for others, the same flipped around can be said about you not able to do a flick swing and we can.
See how that works the other way around?
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Post by Deleted on Dec 8, 2018 1:27:12 GMT -5
Dare I say the “flick” swing has vaulted itself above, despite all odds, the club set debate at this point? Or is that just me? Welcome to the show!!
Do you use a DS4 or a XB1 controller, Justin?
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Post by Deleted on Dec 8, 2018 1:30:06 GMT -5
The flick isn't illegal...but if you're allowing the controller springs to keep your swing on axis, it isn't a natural swing movement and therefore it is likely to produce unnatural results. And if you get flagged for it, then you've made your bed. Live with the consequences. It's not like all of us can choose to use that swing method. It simply doesn't work on PC. I can do a flick with a mouse if I rig up some rubber bands and create a slot for my mouse to move between two wooden blocks. Takes a bit to get used to but I just have to hold down my mouse button and pull it back, the rubber bands does the rest!! Granted it is a little uncomfortable and you have to get used to holding down the mouse button while the mouse moves, but the results!!!
I mean pulling the mouse back a 1/2 inch is hard enough, why should I be bothered to actually move it forward an inch when the rubber bands can do it for me?
Seriously...anyone releasing the controller stick and letting the springs complete the swings is not taking a full swing in my opinion, it is a half swing at best and the person doing it is letting the springs completely the second half of the swing.
That is not what is happening. We (well, I am and have for a long, long time) are simply letting go during the downswing (push forward) so that the slapping of the plastic at the top doesn't give a jagged angle or registers a rebound backwards (although I can get a rebound without even hitting the top just by the natural springiness of the analogs of a DS4).
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Post by Deleted on Dec 8, 2018 1:33:30 GMT -5
Completely different. “Flicking” is a method of swinging using the standard equipment. Anchoring is modifying the equipment allowed. “Anchoring” in no way imaginable modified the equipment. Anchoring simply modifies the method by which a player uses standard equipment in order to provide an artificial advantage. The PGA, USGA, and other governing bodies agree as much, hence the strict ban. A player could use a long putter without anchoring, and the method would be legal. Bernhard Langer putts this way currently - long putter but not anchored. To me, this is just like a player using a standard DS4 to produce a standard golf shot. But when flicking the joystick, the player modifies their method of use (just like anchoring) to produce an artificially advantageous result. I agree that “flicking” is playing the game as designed by the developer, but evidence indicates the straighter-than-normal results are not based on the skill of the player, rather they are based on exploiting a design flaw in the software. A flaw proven by the tutorials. Inherently, that’s a problem. A flaw that needs resolved by HB as this type of swing did not seem to have any advantage in previous TGC versions.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 8, 2018 1:35:28 GMT -5
Put a post with link in shoutout box when you are going live. Have you played your rounds for TGC Tours live with this over the should view with a DS4 controller? Also do a scan of your PS4 to show no Titan One attached to it. If all looks good I would have to think if you were to even get these 18x of the same set value the admins would have no choice to let your scores pass and put all the doubters to rest. . I don't think there's any doubt that he's playing legit, and he has shown in another vid that he has no weird stuff attached. Fadge was flagged for the same reason a few weeks back, as were Bob and Brad just before the season started - it's not cheating and it's not fair to insinuate that there's foul play going on with a Titan or whatever. It's very obvious he's a hardcore flicker and is extremely good at it (other flickers aren't quite as good and so don't get flagged but still get the same results, that's the other aspect of this debate!) I have never been flagged, received an email about my rounds, or been removed from a leaderboard in TGC2 nor in TGC2019. Just saying.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 8, 2018 1:41:39 GMT -5
I don't think there's any doubt that he's playing legit, and he has shown in another vid that he has no weird stuff attached. Fadge was flagged for the same reason a few weeks back, as were Bob and Brad just before the season started - it's not cheating and it's not fair to insinuate that there's foul play going on with a Titan or whatever. It's very obvious he's a hardcore flicker and is extremely good at it (other flickers aren't quite as good and so don't get flagged but still get the same results, that's the other aspect of this debate!) I have never been flagged, received an email about my rounds, or been removed from a leaderboard in TGC2 nor in TGC2019. Just saying.
Whoops sorry, yeah I remember now you guys asked for a check and they said it wouldn't have passed but it obviously wasn't an actual flagging.
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Post by Generic_Casual on Dec 8, 2018 2:31:47 GMT -5
#bobbyb This entire thread is a gem! Also, this is from Habs. He says hello... Habs tired and on vacation again. No answer, no worry. Licky, Licky, how is it? Habs isn't seeing Pinnochio. Habs sees all, no worry still. Habs misses you, not Licky. Edit: Literal message sent to me on PS.
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Post by Dave on Dec 8, 2018 2:42:38 GMT -5
Completely different. “Flicking” is a method of swinging using the standard equipment. Anchoring is modifying the equipment allowed. “Anchoring” in no way imaginable modified the equipment. Anchoring simply modifies the method by which a player uses standard equipment in order to provide an artificial advantage. The PGA, USGA, and other governing bodies agree as much, hence the strict ban. A player could use a long putter without anchoring, and the method would be legal. Bernhard Langer putts this way currently - long putter but not anchored. To me, this is just like a player using a standard DS4 to produce a standard golf shot. But when flicking the joystick, the player modifies their method of use (just like anchoring) to produce an artificially advantageous result. I agree that “flicking” is playing the game as designed by the developer, but evidence indicates the straighter-than-normal results are not based on the skill of the player, rather they are based on exploiting a design flaw in the software. A flaw proven by the tutorials. Inherently, that’s a problem. Ok so I thought broomhandles putters were banned. But still, I’ve used the same method since the first game game out and never had any issues or anyone crying over short swinging. I guess because the so called “elite” players don’t like the fact that us regulars can now keep up with them, it gives them something to point the accusing finger at. It’s not exploiting a flaw if you’ve been doing it long before this game came out. And frankly some people’s constant b%&ing about it is embarrassing. Blame HB, not the people using it.
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Post by fadgewacker on Dec 8, 2018 3:26:31 GMT -5
But it still creates potential advantages, such as making the stroke simpler and more repeatable. So who goes around to everyone's places around the world to police this?
Right, impossible.
So back to the API.
They (here) make it more stringent and I get flagged then I accept it, and then I move on to learn a new swing and look at using a different DS4(s). Pretty much what I told myself before the season started.
Which is exactly what I did, found a new swing, with new controllers, and the jobs a good un. I’m doing alright.
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Post by fadgewacker on Dec 8, 2018 3:29:05 GMT -5
#bobbyb This entire thread is a gem! Also, this is from Habs. He says hello... Habs tired and on vacation again. No answer, no worry. Licky, Licky, how is it? Habs isn't seeing Pinnochio. Habs sees all, no worry still. Habs misses you, not Licky. Edit: Literal message sent to me on PS. 😂😂😂
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Post by Deleted on Dec 8, 2018 6:15:22 GMT -5
“Anchoring” in no way imaginable modified the equipment. Anchoring simply modifies the method by which a player uses standard equipment in order to provide an artificial advantage. The PGA, USGA, and other governing bodies agree as much, hence the strict ban. A player could use a long putter without anchoring, and the method would be legal. Bernhard Langer putts this way currently - long putter but not anchored. To me, this is just like a player using a standard DS4 to produce a standard golf shot. But when flicking the joystick, the player modifies their method of use (just like anchoring) to produce an artificially advantageous result. I agree that “flicking” is playing the game as designed by the developer, but evidence indicates the straighter-than-normal results are not based on the skill of the player, rather they are based on exploiting a design flaw in the software. A flaw proven by the tutorials. Inherently, that’s a problem. Ok so I thought broomhandles putters were banned. But still, I’ve used the same method since the first game game out and never had any issues or anyone crying over short swinging. I guess because the so called “elite” players don’t like the fact that us regulars can now keep up with them, it gives them something to point the accusing finger at. It’s not exploiting a flaw if you’ve been doing it long before this game came out. And frankly some people’s constant b%&ing about it is embarrassing. Blame HB, not the people using it. Using an exploit to match the ‘elite’ guys must give you a real sense of satisfaction 👌🏻
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