|
Post by Airik3333 on Nov 17, 2018 12:39:51 GMT -5
I've always thought the systems should be split up at TGC Tours... 3 systems = 3 different tours.. TGC2019 makes me believe this even more.. They do not play the same.. I own the game on PS4 and PC.. I am a much better player on PS4 and I like to design on PC.. If I played on PC I am betting I would be 2 shots worse per round.. I did not own the PS4 version on TGC2 and found myself on CC-A playing with the PC.. A brief history for me... TGC1 / PS4 player / Out of mid season Q School (July 2015) I was on CC-D.. I slowly worked my way up to the bottom of the Euro Tour (when it was equal to PGA) I crossed over for one PGA event and barely made the cut.. TGC2 / High End PC player / I hated TGC2 swing.. I fell all the way down to CC-C before bouncing back up to CC-A TGC2019 / PS4 player / Made PGA Tour out of Q School by scoring much better than most at Bedes.. I was average on Pearl.. It currently takes close to my very best effort to make a cut on the PGA.. This week I played really well and barely made cut.. If I switched to PC right now - I would slip down to the bottom of Euro and maybe even Web.. CC-A would not shock me.. PS4 has ALWAYS been the best system FOR ME to play my rounds on.. I've heard others say the opposite.. They believe they play better on PC.. It's simple - as much as we want them to play the same - the systems DO NOT PLAY THE SAME... In my opinion, TGC Tours should consider splitting the tours based on the system you want to play.. The good news with that is you would have 3 Masters Champions each year.. What's wrong with that I am on the PGA Tour and I don't consider myself one of the top 250 players at TGC Tours.. There is no way I am better than many of the guys on Euro or WEB.. I just happen to play on PS4 this year and they don't.. I enjoy playing so it really does not matter to me what tour I play on.. It boggles my mind that there are ass hats out there that cheat in this game.. They buy Razors and Titans and use toothpicks, scotch tape, and rubber bands on their controllers.. Get real !
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Nov 17, 2018 12:41:52 GMT -5
Question. Can the people who get pinged for short swinging use a ‘normal’ swing where the stick gets pulled all the way back to the plastic before the animation gets to the top, and push it all the way forward before the animation finishes - and get a full line? If it’s possible, then why can’t they just do that? Seems this short swing produces crazy straight results, so why shouldn’t it be outlawed?
I can understand if people would be upset having to change the way they’ve always played, but I also think that if it’s causing the problem of not giving enough info for the API to judge, then it’s up to the player to use the stick the way the game designers wanted.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Nov 17, 2018 12:51:19 GMT -5
Airik3333 I think a split tour would make sense in principle, and I'd quite like that because I'd actually have a shot of winning an event every now and then lol, but I can't see it happening, the whole appeal of TGCT is this huge multiplatfom tour with thousands of players and an extremely active community. Without multi-platform there's really not much added value to TGCT, so despite the issues with platforms playing so differently (of all the complaints, XB1 master club users have by far the most valid claim to be upset), I'd much rather we continue as it is because this is easily the best game-related community I've ever been involved with. The relentless moaning sucks admittedly but it's still not as bad as other games with packs of rabid teenagers cursing your parents every second sentence lol What might be a nice happy medium would be the ability to filter leaderboards (and maybe even add separate platform WGRs?) by platform, so everybody can get a nice clear snapshot of how they're doing on a truly equal standing. That would just be an info addition rather than separating the tours themselves. Or we can all just buy PS4s and flick -20s to our hearts' content
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Nov 17, 2018 12:56:53 GMT -5
I’m not gonna badmouth your mum Lazza, she taught me.....stuff.
😉
#classyinnit
|
|
|
Post by rob4590 on Nov 17, 2018 13:04:33 GMT -5
Question. Can the people who get pinged for short swinging use a ‘normal’ swing where the stick gets pulled all the way back to the plastic before the animation gets to the top, and push it all the way forward before the animation finishes - and get a full line? If it’s possible, then why can’t they just do that? Seems this short swing produces crazy straight results, so why shouldn’t it be outlawed? I can understand if people would be upset having to change the way they’ve always played, but I also think that if it’s causing the problem of not giving enough info for the API to judge, then it’s up to the player to use the stick the way the game designers wanted.
Maybe I've missed the answer to the following question (which would need to be confirmed before such a rule could be implemented) - and that is:
What does the API actually pick up? Does it pick up the fact that the player is short swinging (does that mean it gets no swing input)? Or does it just flag people for getting minimal / no deviation in their shot patterns over a round?
If it is the latter - then the fact that people are short swinging would be impossible to police and is obviously only coming to light in the FPP threads between them and the admins (or in these threads when they post videos and the short swings can be seen by all).
If it is the former - then that should be easy to outlaw - any more than x swings (to be decided how many) in a round that don't register due to being too short and it's a DQ.
And to take a real-life comparison - it would just be like outlawing the anchored putter - if you did it, then you would simply have to adjust your technique to become legal (eg Webb Simpson going to the short putter) or continue to float right on the edge of legality (eg Langer with his non-anchored broom)
|
|
|
Post by fadgewacker on Nov 17, 2018 13:26:23 GMT -5
First of all not pitching a fit dude. Just pointing out a mjor flaw in the game. I love the game i think the last 2 games have been really good but could of been amazing if they iron out the glitches cos thats wat the short swing is. I not b%&ing cos ive hit it solid and putted really good on the whole,a handful of putts have cost me a win so far but it is wat it is im human and you cant hole them all. Im just backing up players after ive seen all the evidence provided its there in black and white. Is a short swing cheating? No! Is it a glitch that gives ppl an unfair advantage? In the right hands yes! When the tours api isnt detecting a short swing which plays zero deviation although showing wonky as. This needs to be addressed by hb asap. Wasn’t directed at you per se. But while the short swing thing may be an ADVANTAGE, it not an UNFAIR advantage because it’s just a swing technique, not a cheat. Anyone can do it, master it. That’s like saying the click method of determining fade/draw and putt lines is unfair. Look all I’m saying is that the short swing thing cannot be dealt with by the API or made to fail the API unless it is a constant straight short swing or short swing with same deviation pattern which will set off the APIs scripting sniffer. The only way it will be dealt with is HB changing their code to interpolate a full swing or penalize distance on a short swing. Others are saying same. Only issue I have is certain single and double digit WGR folks calling the short swing a cheat or unfair or an exploit. It just is a bad look for those people because it sounds like they are mad they aren’t dominating right now. The thing is, I was told, while short swinging, that my swings were so repeatable and tightly grouped that I would fail API, so I decided to change my swing. The odd short one creeps in. 2 or 3 a round if I’m honest. It’ll be gone totally before long. I was able to produce a swing that would have failed API doing it. I’m fairly good at swinging the stick straight when I get it grooved. Can Sloaner do 4 in a row? Yes. Can I? Yes. Using standard equipment. I couldn’t just do 4 in a row on command, but if I played the same shot over and over I could do it. I could that with a big standard controller. People could modify their controllers to get these results too... it’s a possibility. It’s also not rocket science, expensive or overly technically involved to do, but I’ll still state I could likely do it without any mods. I don’t think for a second that Sloaner just loaded up that practice hole and went “Eyup, 4 have gone in”... he probably hit that shot a lot before he got that result. It still shouldn’t be possible... the biggest issue however is not 4 hole in ones in a row, that would be getting whoever did it DQ’d, it’s the fact that more wonky swings are being allowed to be assisted by this method. I’m not an elite, or a legend, but I can clearly see that this is wrong, and is an unfair advantage. I’m also not out to shady people who are taking advantage of this specifically. I’m only trying to explain through my own experiences, what is wrong with this. The “elites” are correct in what they are saying. This is not sour grapes IMO If one man can short swing too well, and be DQ’d (please believe me when I say that this would not be uncommon at the top end of the tours), and the next man can short swing but have his dispersion massively improved over what it would have been in TGC2, and that can pass the API, how on earth can that NOT be an unfair advantage? EDIT - this was so long in the making (family life!) I’ve missed Sloaner posts. Will catch up.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Nov 17, 2018 13:29:29 GMT -5
What does the API actually pick up? Does it pick up the fact that the player is short swinging (does that mean it gets no swing input)? Or does it just flag people for getting minimal / no deviation in their shot patterns over a round?
It can't identify flicks, it just shows the same left/right dispersion results as a scripter / 3rd party controller, and from what I understand it was only through FPP conversations that they came to realise that the short swing was the reason for the abnormally straight dispersion.So imagine a normal full swing being pretty straight until 2/3 up and then turning towards the edge of the cone at the end (which a lot of us have regularly) - the light-touch short swing player bypasses that final section towards the top where the swing deviates the most, and so the API sees the first 2/3 and just thinks "damn son, this dude be stripin like a mofo" and whips out the flag. Edit: and just to add that this isn't the whole story - as some are suggesting it's possible to take advantage of the short swing now for players who don't shoot straight and therefore avoid waking the api, but their swing still stops before it goes outside the cone towards the top, which makes their results much straighter than they would have been in TGC2, where the game drew the line all the way to the top.
|
|
|
Post by Cyclerob on Nov 17, 2018 13:43:45 GMT -5
Question. Can the people who get pinged for short swinging use a ‘normal’ swing where the stick gets pulled all the way back to the plastic before the animation gets to the top, and push it all the way forward before the animation finishes - and get a full line? If it’s possible, then why can’t they just do that? Seems this short swing produces crazy straight results, so why shouldn’t it be outlawed? I can understand if people would be upset having to change the way they’ve always played, but I also think that if it’s causing the problem of not giving enough info for the API to judge, then it’s up to the player to use the stick the way the game designers wanted. Personally I don't flick it, I make a very smooth transition from backswing to downswing. I don't short swing on purpose and I'm trying to adapt.... But: 1) When make a full swing with a follow through that hits the plastic it rarely register as a completed swing in the HUD 2) Sometime I don't completed my downswing and it registers has a completed swing in the HUD 3) Vice versa 4) The same is true for flops, pitches and punches. I can't reproduce a completed swing in the feedback window on a regular basis. It feels random to me. Can't say if I do this or that, I'll get a full swing in the HUD. How do you guys do it? It's currently a mystery to me! Definately doesn't feel or behaves 1:1 like HB says. Feels to me like a DS4 is not sensitive enough when you apply very light pressure on the swinging stick!
|
|
|
Post by CuseHokie on Nov 17, 2018 13:46:38 GMT -5
Question. Can the people who get pinged for short swinging use a ‘normal’ swing where the stick gets pulled all the way back to the plastic before the animation gets to the top, and push it all the way forward before the animation finishes - and get a full line? If it’s possible, then why can’t they just do that? Seems this short swing produces crazy straight results, so why shouldn’t it be outlawed? I can understand if people would be upset having to change the way they’ve always played, but I also think that if it’s causing the problem of not giving enough info for the API to judge, then it’s up to the player to use the stick the way the game designers wanted.
Maybe I've missed the answer to the following question (which would need to be confirmed before such a rule could be implemented) - and that is:
What does the API actually pick up? Does it pick up the fact that the player is short swinging (does that mean it gets no swing input)? Or does it just flag people for getting minimal / no deviation in their shot patterns over a round?
If it is the latter - then the fact that people are short swinging would be impossible to police and is obviously only coming to light in the FPP threads between them and the admins (or in these threads when they post videos and the short swings can be seen by all).
If it is the former - then that should be easy to outlaw - any more than x swings (to be decided how many) in a round that don't register due to being too short and it's a DQ.
And to take a real-life comparison - it would just be like outlawing the anchored putter - if you did it, then you would simply have to adjust your technique to become legal (eg Webb Simpson going to the short putter) or continue to float right on the edge of legality (eg Langer with his non-anchored broom)
It can only detect deviations of swing accuracy (think of left to right). It can’t detect short swings in its current form.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Nov 17, 2018 13:50:45 GMT -5
Question. Can the people who get pinged for short swinging use a ‘normal’ swing where the stick gets pulled all the way back to the plastic before the animation gets to the top, and push it all the way forward before the animation finishes - and get a full line? If it’s possible, then why can’t they just do that? Seems this short swing produces crazy straight results, so why shouldn’t it be outlawed? I can understand if people would be upset having to change the way they’ve always played, but I also think that if it’s causing the problem of not giving enough info for the API to judge, then it’s up to the player to use the stick the way the game designers wanted. Personally I don't flick it, I make a very smooth transition from backswing to downswing. I don't short swing on purpose and I'm trying to adapt.... But: 1) When make a full swing with a follow through that hits the plastic it rarely register as a completed swing in the HUD 2) Sometime I don't completed my downswing and it registers has a completed swing in the HUD 3) Vice versa 4) The same is true for flops, pitches and punches. I can't reproduce a completed swing in the feedback window on a regular basis. It feels random to me. Can't say if I do this or that, I'll get a full swing in the HUD. How do you guys do it? It's currently a mystery to me! Definately doesn't feel or behaves 1:1 like HB says. Feels to me like a DS4 is not sensitive enough when you apply very light pressure on the swinging stick! I’m on XBox, I just do what I described as a ‘normal’ swing. I pull it back quite firmly until it hits the plastic, then wait for the animation to catch up, then push it forward quite firmly to the plastic. For me tempo is tough, but I think that’s the fact I’m on XBox rather than a problem with what I’m doing. I don’t always get a full line, particularly on putts, chips, flops and pitches - but I play them below 100% to make the tempo easier if I can. That was kinda the point I was getting at - can you make it produce a full line on a normal full swing? Not including the short game. If you can’t then that’s a whole different issue.
|
|
|
Post by B.Smooth13 on Nov 17, 2018 13:51:52 GMT -5
Eh...I'll just keep playing the game for fun, like always, and let the chips fall where they may. I get short feedback a couple of times a round or so, I think (don't really remember that kind of stuff after rounds), which mostly happen when I instinctively feel that I'm going slow/fast on the downswing and flick or lessen pressure once the joystick gets above the center point to even out the tempo. It's not really a conscious process, it's more of a reflex when it happens.
Anyway - yes, it's a bummer that we aren't all on a level paying field, but no, I also don't think it's entirely fair to punish those who have always used this method in these types of games for years and years. Seems like HB should just take the last point of downswing input and extrapolate the API/input data out to the top of the line based on something like an exponential line of best fit from the downswing data provided. That would force every swing to have input data going all the way up, regardless of whether that input was user created or simply interpolated to the top of the swing based on user input before that input stopped short.
|
|
|
Post by fadgewacker on Nov 17, 2018 14:09:51 GMT -5
What does the API actually pick up? Does it pick up the fact that the player is short swinging (does that mean it gets no swing input)? Or does it just flag people for getting minimal / no deviation in their shot patterns over a round?
It can't identify flicks, it just shows the same left/right dispersion results as a scripter / 3rd party controller, and from what I understand it was only through FPP conversations that they came to realise that the short swing was the reason for the abnormally straight dispersion.So imagine a normal full swing being pretty straight until 2/3 up and then turning towards the edge of the cone at the end (which a lot of us have regularly) - the light-touch short swing player bypasses that final section towards the top where the swing deviates the most, and so the API sees the first 2/3 and just thinks "damn son, this dude be stripin like a mofo" and whips out the flag. Edit: and just to add that this isn't the whole story - as some are suggesting it's possible to take advantage of the short swing now for players who don't shoot straight and therefore avoid waking the api, but their swing still stops before it goes outside the cone towards the top, which makes their results much straighter than they would have been in TGC2, where the game drew the line all the way to the top. No suggestion where your edit is concerned Larry. It’s the main issue at hand.
|
|
|
Post by fadgewacker on Nov 17, 2018 14:14:46 GMT -5
Personally I don't flick it, I make a very smooth transition from backswing to downswing. I don't short swing on purpose and I'm trying to adapt.... But: 1) When make a full swing with a follow through that hits the plastic it rarely register as a completed swing in the HUD 2) Sometime I don't completed my downswing and it registers has a completed swing in the HUD 3) Vice versa 4) The same is true for flops, pitches and punches. I can't reproduce a completed swing in the feedback window on a regular basis. It feels random to me. Can't say if I do this or that, I'll get a full swing in the HUD. How do you guys do it? It's currently a mystery to me! Definately doesn't feel or behaves 1:1 like HB says. Feels to me like a DS4 is not sensitive enough when you apply very light pressure on the swinging stick! I’m on XBox, I just do what I described as a ‘normal’ swing. I pull it back quite firmly until it hits the plastic, then wait for the animation to catch up, then push it forward quite firmly to the plastic. For me tempo is tough, but I think that’s the fact I’m on XBox rather than a problem with what I’m doing. I don’t always get a full line, particularly on putts, chips, flops and pitches - but I play them below 100% to make the tempo easier if I can. That was kinda the point I was getting at - can you make it produce a full line on a normal full swing? Not including the short game. If you can’t then that’s a whole different issue. I can
|
|
|
Post by Brighttail on Nov 17, 2018 14:15:10 GMT -5
You are right, the point isn't the four in a row. By the way thanks and a kudos to Sloaner who showed us what is possible. What is the scary part is being able to do that type of swing and then adjust slightly so the API can't pick it up, once again like Sloan showed. Not that hard it seems.
|
|
|
Post by B.Smooth13 on Nov 17, 2018 14:18:32 GMT -5
Ps only need a final round of -25 to tie for the lead. That seems doable...
|
|