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Post by cseanny on Aug 9, 2020 9:40:14 GMT -5
My preference; TST: legend without the power meter. TGCTours: masters without the power meter. Want to play pro or easier? Play in your own societies. Job done. TST is going to be a real challenge in the game. I don't think I saw a stream with somebody playing the master swing difficulty. I am a bit concerned that the legendary swing sensitivity might make it controller dependant. Seamount (on and off) and Andre (2nd stream portion at the beginning) both used Masters. Imo playing Legend would create a huge skill gap within some of the tours which would definitely show up in the leader boards. I could easily see Only the same 3 or 4 guys win every single event. I know you like IRL (not poking fun btw), so take a top PGA professional and pair him up with a +1 handicap Amateur. Now have them play a standard, easy PGA event and them have them play a round on a US Open condition course. Just sayin', if you want Legend, be careful what you wish for .
Regarding Master vs. Pro settings, I'd take this same mentality into TGCTs CC-A through Z tours too. Obviously A LOT of testing must take place, but in my eyes, the best place to start is PGA/Euro/KF and TST should play on Masters while all CCs are on Pro.
And it will be very interesting to see how the API plays out, especially with the introduction of the swing plane attribute.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 9, 2020 10:06:22 GMT -5
TST is going to be a real challenge in the game. I don't think I saw a stream with somebody playing the master swing difficulty. I am a bit concerned that the legendary swing sensitivity might make it controller dependant. Seamount (on and off) and Andre (2nd stream portion at the beginning) both used Masters. Imo playing Legend would create a huge skill gap within some of the tours which would definitely show up in the leader boards. I could easily see Only the same 3 or 4 guys win every single event. I know you like IRL (not poking fun btw), so take a top PGA professional and pair him up with a +1 handicap Amateur. Now have them play a standard, easy PGA event and them have them play a round on a US Open condition course. Just sayin', if you want Legend, be careful what you wish for .
Regarding Master vs. Pro settings, I'd take this same mentality into TGCTs CC-A through Z tours too. Obviously A LOT of testing must take place, but in my eyes, the best place to start is PGA/Euro/KF and TST should play on Masters while all CCs are on Pro.
And it will be very interesting to see how the API plays out, especially with the introduction of the swing plane attribute.
Making the swing and tempo extremely difficult and then having aids to help with distance control is not what I was looking for. We will now have an overpowered splash shot that is used from everywhere off the green. Been watching the golf on TV all day, highlights from The PGA Championship and the European Tour English Championship at a great course I played a couple of years ago Hanbury Manor. Not once have I seen a pro play a splash shot from anywhere but a bunker today. Also you very rarely seen pro's play the flop even when short sided. Some are better at it than others but it is a shot you attempt when you have no green to work with. Last week I played one of my best pitch shots from out of the heavy rough with my 60 degree. 30 yards away over a bunker to 2 foot. Pitch and chip is the percentage shot in real golf. Splash and flop is in the new game from many scenarios it seems.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 9, 2020 10:21:12 GMT -5
Seamount (on and off) and Andre (2nd stream portion at the beginning) both used Masters. Imo playing Legend would create a huge skill gap within some of the tours which would definitely show up in the leader boards. I could easily see Only the same 3 or 4 guys win every single event. I know you like IRL (not poking fun btw), so take a top PGA professional and pair him up with a +1 handicap Amateur. Now have them play a standard, easy PGA event and them have them play a round on a US Open condition course. Just sayin', if you want Legend, be careful what you wish for .
Regarding Master vs. Pro settings, I'd take this same mentality into TGCTs CC-A through Z tours too. Obviously A LOT of testing must take place, but in my eyes, the best place to start is PGA/Euro/KF and TST should play on Masters while all CCs are on Pro.
And it will be very interesting to see how the API plays out, especially with the introduction of the swing plane attribute.
Making the swing and tempo extremely difficult and then having aids to help with distance control is not what I was looking for. We will now have an overpowered splash shot that is used from everywhere off the green. Been watching the golf on TV all day, highlights from The PGA Championship and the European Tour English Championship at a great course I played a couple of years ago Hanbury Manor. Not once have I seen a pro play a splash shot from anywhere but a bunker today. Also you very rarely seen pro's play the flop even when short sided. Some are better at it than others but it is a shot you attempt when you have no green to work with. Last week I played one of my best pitch shots from out of the heavy rough with my 60 degree. 30 yards away over a bunker to 2 foot. Pitch and chip is the percentage shot in real golf. Splash and flop is in the new game from many scenarios it seems. It is a big problem in all video golf games that have been made. Flop shot has never been hard enough in any game. And the second problem is how easy it is in the game to scramble from the rough. I don't know if you have watched the dev's playthrough with Shaun West - but it illustrates perfectly that he doesn't know how hard this shot is in heavy rough. The last he plays is the 18th on East Lake - and he misses the approach to the right between the bunkers and get a nasty rough lie - or so it is in real life. The last place you want to miss. And he says "luckily the ball didn't roll down into the bunker". What?! Every pro would prefer the bunker lie to the rough lie any day. That rough shot is impossible in real life. You will almost never get that ball close to the tucked pin. Yet, he flops it to a tap in birdie with too much spin. So unfortunately, this issue is not solved in PGA2K21 - and it seems at least one of the devs doesn't know how this is in real life.
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Post by cseanny on Aug 9, 2020 10:29:17 GMT -5
@andersnm Also, the ability to pick wedge sets with near max shot shaping attributes will enable every short game shot to be extremely precise and accurate. I don't foresee many shots outside of 3-5 feet. Once tempo is mastered, I can see somewhat similar results for the majority of wedge approaches too.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 9, 2020 10:42:46 GMT -5
Making the swing and tempo extremely difficult and then having aids to help with distance control is not what I was looking for. We will now have an overpowered splash shot that is used from everywhere off the green. Been watching the golf on TV all day, highlights from The PGA Championship and the European Tour English Championship at a great course I played a couple of years ago Hanbury Manor. Not once have I seen a pro play a splash shot from anywhere but a bunker today. Also you very rarely seen pro's play the flop even when short sided. Some are better at it than others but it is a shot you attempt when you have no green to work with. Last week I played one of my best pitch shots from out of the heavy rough with my 60 degree. 30 yards away over a bunker to 2 foot. Pitch and chip is the percentage shot in real golf. Splash and flop is in the new game from many scenarios it seems. It is a big problem in all video golf games that have been made. Flop shot has never been hard enough in any game. And the second problem is how easy it is in the game to scramble from the rough. I don't know if you have watched the dev's playthrough with Shaun West - but it illustrates perfectly that he doesn't know how hard this shot is in heavy rough. The last he plays is the 18th on East Lake - and he misses the approach to the right between the bunkers and get a nasty rough lie - or so it is in real life. The last place you want to miss. And he says "luckily the ball didn't roll down into the bunker". What?! Every pro would prefer the bunker lie to the rough lie any day. That rough shot is impossible in real life. You will almost never get that ball close to the tucked pin. Yet, he flops it to a tap in birdie with too much spin. So unfortunately, this issue is not solved in PGA2K21 - and it seems at least one of the devs doesn't know how this is in real life. I remember Danny Willey playing a flop(parachute shot the commentator liked to call it) and the ball rolled out a good 30 foot. There is a misconception that the flop is a high spin shot. The club face is too open to create a lot of spin and you need bounce. Watching a video of Phil Mickelson, he said there is danger of hitting under the ball not getting the bounce and the ball not moving at all when playing out of rough. Would like to see a stat of how often the flop shot is played on the PGA Tour compared to pitch. Anyway as you said it way too easy in the game. I should be an extremely difficult shot to play so the reward when it comes off would have that feeling like holing a long putt. You could actually blade the ball with off tempo flops in TGC 2 not sure why that took that out.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 9, 2020 10:46:42 GMT -5
@andersnm Also, the ability to pick wedge sets with near max shot shaping attributes will enable every short game shot to be extremely precise and accurate. I don't foresee many shots outside of 3-5 feet. Once tempo is mastered, I can see somewhat similar results for the majority of wedge approaches too. From what I've seen on the attributes - they are not realistic and look very gamey. You do not loose 20+ yards if you change driver in real life. But granted - I have not seen all there is to these attributes, but for a first impression - not good. That being said - attributes or not, scrambling is most likely too easy in the new game as well, and that is in my view down to how easy it is to hit chips and flops from the heavy rough (I am not going into splash (I use the term explosive shots for these) as they are unrealistic outside sand in almost all circumstances). Also - this is for the higher difficulties - master and legend. I do not mind that short game is easy on the easy difficulties.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 9, 2020 10:53:09 GMT -5
It is a big problem in all video golf games that have been made. Flop shot has never been hard enough in any game. And the second problem is how easy it is in the game to scramble from the rough. I don't know if you have watched the dev's playthrough with Shaun West - but it illustrates perfectly that he doesn't know how hard this shot is in heavy rough. The last he plays is the 18th on East Lake - and he misses the approach to the right between the bunkers and get a nasty rough lie - or so it is in real life. The last place you want to miss. And he says "luckily the ball didn't roll down into the bunker". What?! Every pro would prefer the bunker lie to the rough lie any day. That rough shot is impossible in real life. You will almost never get that ball close to the tucked pin. Yet, he flops it to a tap in birdie with too much spin. So unfortunately, this issue is not solved in PGA2K21 - and it seems at least one of the devs doesn't know how this is in real life. I remember Danny Willey playing a flop(parachute shot the commentator liked to call it) and the ball rolled out a good 30 foot. There is a misconception that the flop is a high spin shot. The club face is too open to create a lot of spin and you need bounce. Watching a video of Phil Mickelson, he said there is danger of hitting under the ball not getting the bounce and the ball not moving at all when playing out of rough. Would like to see a stat of how often the flop shot is played on the PGA Tour compared to pitch. Anyway as you said it way too easy in the game. I should be an extremely difficult shot to play so the reward when it comes off would have that feeling like holing a long putt. You could actually blade the ball with off tempo flops in TGC 2 not sure why that took that out. In the rough, you loose almost all spin due to grass as well. Yes - if you have watched Phil's "secrets of the short game" he explains the different lies - if the ball sits up in the rough or down in the rough. If the ball sits up, you need to have more neutral weight in order to not hit under the ball and actually not hitting the ball. In a deep lie that same shot will get in too high on the ball, so you need the weight more forward to drive the club under the ball. If you hit that hard under the ball when the ball sits up - you get too much under the ball and the ball will not move. They have sort of the blade on off tempo shots in 2019 - it is a very fast downswing tempo. A very slow tempo represents a duff.
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Post by cseanny on Aug 9, 2020 16:00:28 GMT -5
Yes, I am extremely excited and can't wait!!!!! Give me game now! Having said that, I genuinely feel bad for some of the "sim and purist" crowd, and this is coming from an Arcade junky! Taking a look at the HB forums, some of the things HB_Craig is stating in regards to the rumble, practice swing, and power bar features are mind boggling.
edit: Craig has put up an "internal discussion" list after Seamounts fair and balanced post. This is a good sign and shows a genuine interest (we hope!) towards listening to players feedback; especially the ones who have already played the game!
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Post by Billy Hoyle on Aug 9, 2020 16:34:50 GMT -5
My preference; TST: legend without the power meter. TGCTours: masters without the power meter. Want to play pro or easier? Play in your own societies. Job done. TST is going to be a real challenge in the game. I don't think I saw a stream with somebody playing the master swing difficulty. I am a bit concerned that the legendary swing sensitivity might make it controller dependant. TST is going to be a different beast in the new game with NO flyover at the beginning of each hole and that new yardage book looks good but may prove useless as it looked like in the streams to NOT show elevation changes on it............
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Post by nevadaballin on Aug 9, 2020 16:47:35 GMT -5
Most of us have been gamers for years. Some of us decades. The swing timing will be figured in 1 day by most. Half a day by those who have a metronome.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 9, 2020 20:15:55 GMT -5
TST is going to be a real challenge in the game. I don't think I saw a stream with somebody playing the master swing difficulty. I am a bit concerned that the legendary swing sensitivity might make it controller dependant. TST is going to be a different beast in the new game with NO flyover at the beginning of each hole and that new yardage book looks good but may prove useless as it looked like in the streams to NOT show elevation changes on it............ Yeah, methinks if there’s a way to show elevation then that setting needs to be on.
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Post by bigned56 on Aug 9, 2020 21:00:31 GMT -5
Whats a metronome
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Post by Art Vandelay on Aug 9, 2020 21:15:52 GMT -5
It's a little fella who lives in a densely populated area. Oh wait, that is a Metro Gnome. Carry on.
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Post by bigned56 on Aug 9, 2020 21:25:42 GMT -5
It's a little fella who lives in a densely populated area. Oh wait, that is a Metro Gnome. Carry on.
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Post by bigned56 on Aug 9, 2020 21:27:01 GMT -5
Could be one and the same you never know these days
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