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Post by joegolferg on Dec 21, 2018 14:22:00 GMT -5
But according to the US government, the Vietnamese were worse than terrorists... And you pulled out, nothing happened afterwards. Lol.... Was that an official statement from the USA government? Who said it and when did they say it? I need a reference. Well why else would you saturate the whole of Vietnam with agent orange? Was that a friendly gesture? |
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Post by paulus on Dec 21, 2018 14:35:19 GMT -5
Non of these interventions have anything to do with terrorism. That's been the perfect excuse for western nations to take oil and land. The more presence you have around the world, the more dominant you become. Imperialism. Completely agree with the first statement. We only differ on semantics in the 2nd part... it's not about taking oil... it's about keeping it flowing. Prices need to stay low, so the big refineries (US being largest) can make good profit and so that oil price shocks don't destabilize our economies. Saddam had to be removed because he was seen as ongoing impediment to keeping a good steady supply hitting the market. |
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Post by joegolferg on Dec 21, 2018 14:43:25 GMT -5
Non of these interventions have anything to do with terrorism. That's been the perfect excuse for western nations to take oil and land. The more presence you have around the world, the more dominant you become. Imperialism. Completely agree with the first statement. We only differ on semantics in the 2nd part... it's not about taking oil... it's about keeping it flowing. Prices need to stay low, so the big refineries (US being largest) can make good profit and so that oil price shocks don't destabilize our economies. Saddam had to be removed because he was seen as ongoing impediment to keeping a good steady supply hitting the market. Yes but, taking oil IS controlling oil and its prices, especially when it's coming from one of the biggest producers. I understand the need for oil barons to keep prices low and I think that falls nicely into the category of "taking oil." Total control of oil. |
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Post by paulus on Dec 21, 2018 14:55:53 GMT -5
Yep, like I say it's semantics, but Iraq do "own" their oil in the strictest sense of the word. Ie they can choose to sell it to whoever they like (must be a refinery tho - no-one can use crude - so US, China, Russia are the primary buyers)... but as long as they are selling it largely we're OK. When they stop, well they are not free to do that, that's when we invade...
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Post by joegolferg on Dec 21, 2018 15:23:45 GMT -5
Yep, like I say it's semantics, but Iraq do "own" their oil in the strictest sense of the word. Ie they can choose to sell it to whoever they like (must be a refinery tho - no-one can use crude - so US, China, Russia are the primary buyers)... but as long as they are selling it largely we're OK. When they stop, well they are not free to do that, that's when we invade... Sort of. Iraq has oil but isn't in control of what happens to it, even in a literal sense, as foreign oil companies have taken over the biggest fields in Iraq, BP having one of them. Choosing who you want to sell it to out of a shortlist basically takes out the word "their" from oil ownership. |
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Post by nevadaballin on Dec 21, 2018 15:49:26 GMT -5
Lol.... Was that an official statement from the USA government? Who said it and when did they say it? I need a reference. Well why else would you saturate the whole of Vietnam with agent orange? Was that a friendly gesture? That's not an actual reference that I asked for and did not answer my question. But hey, if we want to dig up the evilness of each other's countries over the course of history we can do that but it would just be a waste of time..... we're not even 300 years old yet. I'll just pick something out of mid-air though, just for kicks..... European massacre of Native Americans to take their everything.  This is not a road we want to go down Joe. I'd much rather discuss the current day's events instead of going back in time to display how horrible the human race is. |
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Post by nevadaballin on Dec 21, 2018 15:53:38 GMT -5
We haven't taken any oil or land. You are confusing us with Russia. You haven't taken control of oil field in Iraq? Do you know what the first decree in Iraq - post Hussein, was? As far as I know, America does not own nor have we taken over any oil fields from Iraq. We may be defending the land in conjunction with Iraqi forces, but it is not ours. It is totally Iraq's. I'm open to seeing any evidence to the contrary that is present day, right now, happening. |
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Post by joegolferg on Dec 21, 2018 16:58:59 GMT -5
You haven't taken control of oil field in Iraq? Do you know what the first decree in Iraq - post Hussein, was? As far as I know, America does not own nor have we taken over any oil fields from Iraq. We may be defending the land in conjunction with Iraqi forces, but it is not ours. It is totally Iraq's. I'm open to seeing any evidence to the contrary that is present day, right now, happening. Majnoon and West Quma are two large fields run by Shell. Before the invasion, Iraq had its own nationalized oil industry that obviously ran all oil fields in Iraq. They could sell to whoever they want at whatever price they wanted. The Iraqi government can no longer do that, which effectively means that Iraq no longer owns its own oil reserves. No matter how its spun, Iraq oil in now Western oil. |
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Post by joegolferg on Dec 21, 2018 16:59:33 GMT -5
Anyway, enjoyed tonight's debate and I'm off to bed, now. Good night.
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Post by nevadaballin on Dec 21, 2018 17:37:36 GMT -5
As far as I know, America does not own nor have we taken over any oil fields from Iraq. We may be defending the land in conjunction with Iraqi forces, but it is not ours. It is totally Iraq's. I'm open to seeing any evidence to the contrary that is present day, right now, happening. Majnoon and West Quma are two large fields run by Shell. Before the invasion, Iraq had its own nationalized oil industry that obviously ran all oil fields in Iraq. They could sell to whoever they want at whatever price they wanted. The Iraqi government can no longer do that, which effectively means that Iraq no longer owns its own oil reserves. No matter how its spun, Iraq oil in now Western oil. I'm reading Shell (which is actually "Royal Dutch Shell plc") no longer has those...... and that would be a British-Dutch corp, not American. Point that finger the other way bud Good discussion though, have a good night. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 21, 2018 20:38:23 GMT -5
I miss all the fun, stupid Australian time zones...
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Post by joegolferg on Dec 22, 2018 4:22:09 GMT -5
Majnoon and West Quma are two large fields run by Shell. Before the invasion, Iraq had its own nationalized oil industry that obviously ran all oil fields in Iraq. They could sell to whoever they want at whatever price they wanted. The Iraqi government can no longer do that, which effectively means that Iraq no longer owns its own oil reserves. No matter how its spun, Iraq oil in now Western oil. I'm reading Shell (which is actually "Royal Dutch Shell plc") no longer has those...... and that would be a British-Dutch corp, not American. Point that finger the other way bud Good discussion though, have a good night. Had no idea that Shell was British/Dutch. Can't let you off the hook though. Exxon has the West Qurma field. And that's all I'm saying because I'd just prefer to watch you fella's dig into Trump, today. But I welcome his announcement to withdraw troops from Syria. Well done, Trump, you massive twat. |
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Post by joegolferg on Dec 22, 2018 7:48:29 GMT -5
Aside from the gulags, Russia still has all of those things that are listed. Am I right?
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Post by cliffs on Dec 22, 2018 7:55:50 GMT -5
Service contracts licensing results | Field / Block | Company | Home Country | Company Type | Share in Field | | Majnoon | Shell | Netherlands | Public | 45% | | Majnoon | Petronas | Malaysia | State | 30% | | Halfaya | CNPC | China | State | 37.5% | | Halfaya | Petronas | Malaysia | State | 18.75% | | Halfaya | Total | France | Public | 18.75% | | Rumaila | BP | UK | Public | 37.5% | | Rumaila | CNPC | China | State | 37.5% | | Zubair | ENI | Italy | Public | 37.81% | | Zubair | Occidental | US | Public | 23.44% | | Zubair | KOGAS | Korea | State | 18.75% | | West Qurna | Lukoil | Russia | Public | 75% | | Badra | Gazprom | Russia | State | 30% | | Badra | Petronas | Malaysia | State | 15% | | Badra | KOGAS | Korea | State | 22.5% | | Badra | TPAO | Turkey | State | 7.5% | | West Qurna | Exxon | USA | Public | 60% | | West Qurna | Shell | Netherlands | Public | 15% | | Qayara | Sonangol | Angola | State | 75% | | Najmah | Sonangol | Angola | State | 75% | | Garraf | Petronas | Malaysia | State | 40% | | Garraf | JAPEX | Japan | Public | 30% | | Missan Group | CNOOC | China | State | 63.75% | | Missan Group | TPAO | Turkey | State | 11.25% |
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Post by joegolferg on Dec 22, 2018 8:10:26 GMT -5
All a bunch of twats.
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