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Post by timeracer on Jul 9, 2017 21:48:21 GMT -5
After a couple weeks it seems pretty clear that Tour clubs are going to be required to win. That should be the end of the debate, why outlaw something that you won't be able to win? Players clubs will give people more consistency, and in my opinion the Tour Clubs are more fun because even when playing well you're always one shot away from trouble. but at the end of the day, the risk/reward for tour clubs seems correct to me Without yet playing one tournament, I think it's too early to proclaim what will and won't happen. If a course has narrow fairways with small plateau greens, I don't believe it's out of the question for Player mode to win a four round tournament. Here's a good question: If a Player mode person wins and a Tour mode player finishes second, who had a better week? The player that finished in first. It can be argued that someone using player clubs actually had to play better than a player using tour. The one using player clubs will have longer approaches with not as much spin and generally longer putts. Especially once the coming tricked up for tour players courses start becoming the norm. I still think they should have kept the swing exactly as it was in TGC1 where the competitive balance was about as close as it could be. Everyone could hit it relatively straight with whatever device they were using and there were difficulty settings if you actually wanted to not be able to hit it straight. Now it appears it's all going to come down to how good or bad your pad is. Even with bone stock controllers people are reporting wild differences in how they play. Think any semblance of a level playing field is out the door regardless of what set of clubs is used. |
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Post by cdw1223 on Jul 9, 2017 21:54:17 GMT -5
If you get to pick your clubs in the tournaments, which you do so far.
Id like to have a leader board with the players using tour clubs and players using the player clubs.. And whatever the other ones are..
Maybe that's a solution.. Its not a normal Stat, the overall low score still wins the tourney I guess, & the top guys using the other sets if clubs get a nice cut of coins also.
Maybe that's just a first six month thing till we get some numbers, and adjust the game a bit.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 9, 2017 22:00:59 GMT -5
If you get to pick your clubs in the tournaments, which you do so far. Id like to have a leader board with the players using tour clubs and players using the player clubs.. And whatever the other ones are.. Maybe that's a solution.. Its not a normal Stat, the overall low score still wins the tourney I guess, & the top guys using the other sets if clubs get a nice cut of coins also. Maybe that's just a first six month thing till we get some numbers, and adjust the game a bit. The events are zero coin buy in, so no purse. The Societies are being used because it is the only way to tie in with TGCT's structure atm, not for coin or in game benefits. |
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Post by catcherman22 on Jul 9, 2017 22:14:14 GMT -5
Take Oakmont for example...
I had a pw into #1 using the tour clubs... nice to only have to allow for a few yards of roll versus having to land on front of green.
I reached the 600 yard par 5 in two... with a 300 yard 2nd shot.
I was able to drive it on 17 and have 15 feet for eagle.
None of those are possible in player clubs.... and I only missed two greens in reg and two fairways.
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Post by ErixonStone on Jul 9, 2017 22:22:27 GMT -5
If a course has narrow fairways with small plateau greens, I don't believe it's out of the question for Player mode to win a four round tournament. No, it certainly isn't. And that's OK. It'll be up to the schedulers to determine how often a course will fit the Player swing better. Right now, almost all courses fit the Player swing. They tend to be shorter, narrower and have more accessible pins to accommodate firm TGC1 settings. |
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Post by mrohde4 on Jul 9, 2017 22:30:39 GMT -5
Take Oakmont for example... I had a pw into #1 using the tour clubs... nice to only have to allow for a few yards of roll versus having to land on front of green. I reached the 600 yard par 5 in two... with a 300 yard 2nd shot. I was able to drive it on 17 and have 15 feet for eagle. None of those are possible in player clubs.... and I only missed two greens in reg and two fairways. Well that's a heck of a round! But surely you can envision a round where the driver gets a little loose or takes a few bad hops into the rough. All of a sudden you could have five or six 15-footers for bogey. A mid-60s round can turn into mid-70s pretty quickly. At the same time a Player mode person might be farther back each hole but in the middle of the fairway with practically guaranteed middle-of-the-green second shots without breaking a sweat. My point is that Tour mode does not guarantee an advantage in every round, especially with a firm fairway course. Player clubs can hit the ball pretty far, yet less attention to detail and precision is required to keep the shots straight. All I'm saying is that allowing both can potentially distort the results of who are the best players, which in my opinion is a problem. I want so badly to use Tour mode on these tours, but if I consistently miss cuts to players using Player mode, why should I continue to battle with Tour mode? We're beating the dead horse at this point, and I never believed I'd ever become this passionate about video game golf, but regardless I enjoy the conversation fellas. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 9, 2017 23:25:34 GMT -5
Less than 2 weeks. Any update on the plan?
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Post by SloanerTW on Jul 9, 2017 23:49:45 GMT -5
Exactly we all have bad holes where we hit a fast downswing and get a par but it makes up for all the great holes where we stick it within 2 feet on a pin 3 boxes from the front edge. I 100% agree the really good players using Tour clubs will win over those using Player clubs. Not even a debate. But what about the mid to bottom half players of both PGA and Euro fighting not to be demoted or make cuts? How can you properly evaluate who is "better" at the game if you are using two different difficulty levels? If I am choosing to use Tour clubs because I love the feel having some difficulty and uncertainty with my swing, does this make me a worse player than someone consistently scoring well using Players clubs? Your argument is great for the really good players who can compete each week for win, but we all know this group of folks is small. This won't change for TGC 2. The really good players will still be really good, even with Tour clubs. I also think that these are initial opinions and we need a few tournaments to really see how things shake out. I really wish TGCT used these four weeks to run some practice events and designated Tour/Player clubs amongst the players. The awnser is really simple. Theres a heck of a lot more to this game than the clubs you pick. Mid to bottom guys struggling will struggle no matter what. Player clubs will only do so much. |
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Post by colgreenshields on Jul 10, 2017 1:40:56 GMT -5
Been playing exclusively with tour clubs since release and have had some up and down rounds but overall I like the fact that every shot requires some concentration as an errant shot is always possible.
As an experiment I decided to mix things up a bit and try both the player and standard clubs today at the 4 round Hershey Open in Taste's Hershey Golf Academy society.
I went 68-62-66-66. First and last round with tour clubs, second round with player and third round with standard.
Bear in mind that this is the first time I have played with anything other than tour clubs, I can say with some certainty that player clubs felt like they were a big advantage. The lack of distance off the tee was negligible and with the farcical wind conditions that the game currently enjoys, I was out driving some of my tour ghosts on some holes. The increased accuracy was far more significant and advantageous and with a little more practice I feel that the game would revert to TGC 1 type scoring for me.
Dress it up any way you want but these different clubs represent difficulty levels and on that basis I would implore the organisers here to make tour clubs mandatory on the PGA, Euro and TST Tours.
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Post by mattco on Jul 10, 2017 2:01:34 GMT -5
I have sat back and waited for community feedback on this issue. I worked my way to the euro tour in tgc1 (no debate there about which clubs). The thing I have noticed most is varying feedback between platforms. I'm on ps4 and TOUR clubs are a nightmare. It is almost impossible to get any form of consistency and if they were compulsory on either top tour it would be a deal breaker for me. I don't mind a smaller cone, higher level of difficulty etc. but having played s lot of real and computer golf in my time, 40 yard rope hooks with 7 irons is completely unrealistic. I dont mind hitting poor shots, making a bogey with that sort of club, it happens but doubles and triples, once or twice a month maybe. Unless something is done to reduce the sensitivity with ps4 controllers I think we are at a severe disadvantage.
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Post by mcbogga on Jul 10, 2017 3:18:15 GMT -5
After a couple weeks it seems pretty clear that Tour clubs are going to be required to win. That should be the end of the debate, why outlaw something that you won't be able to win? Players clubs will give people more consistency, and in my opinion the Tour Clubs are more fun because even when playing well you're always one shot away from trouble. but at the end of the day, the risk/reward for tour clubs seems correct to me Exactly we all have bad holes where we hit a fast downswing and get a par but it makes up for all the great holes where we stick it within 2 feet on a pin 3 boxes from the front edge. If that would read: "Exactly we all have bad holes where we hit a fast downswing and get a BOGEY" Then all would be so much better. Either way I have changed my mind. These guys are really good and it's Tour clubs or go home for top players. HB may have dumbed tour clubs down a bit as well it feels like. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 10, 2017 3:25:08 GMT -5
I have sat back and waited for community feedback on this issue. I worked my way to the euro tour in tgc1 (no debate there about which clubs). The thing I have noticed most is varying feedback between platforms. I'm on ps4 and TOUR clubs are a nightmare. It is almost impossible to get any form of consistency and if they were compulsory on either top tour it would be a deal breaker for me. I don't mind a smaller cone, higher level of difficulty etc. but having played s lot of real and computer golf in my time, 40 yard rope hooks with 7 irons is completely unrealistic. I dont mind hitting poor shots, making a bogey with that sort of club, it happens but doubles and triples, once or twice a month maybe. Unless something is done to reduce the sensitivity with ps4 controllers I think we are at a severe disadvantage. I'm on PS4. Has it been proven it's harder? Please say yes. |
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Post by AFCTUJacko on Jul 10, 2017 3:33:37 GMT -5
But surely you can envision a round where the driver gets a little loose or takes a few bad hops into the rough. All of a sudden you could have five or six 15-footers for bogey. A mid-60s round can turn into mid-70s pretty quickly. At the same time a Player mode person might be farther back each hole but in the middle of the fairway with practically guaranteed middle-of-the-green second shots without breaking a sweat. This was my experience of Oakmont yesterday.
Round 1 - swing was on point, so I was 300 yards+ down every fairway, and had mid-short irons that would spin into every green. Result - 62 that would have been 59 had my putter behaved. No doubt using the tour clubs gained me 3-4 shots.
Round 2 - Kept finding the cabbage off the tee and was scrambling to make par on almost every hole. 71. No doubt here I could have got to 66-67, or even lower, using the Players.
No doubt with the scoring we've seen so far that Tour is the way to go the Pro tours. I think it's awesome that you can go from low 60's to 70 something just like that.
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Post by frank70 on Jul 10, 2017 3:39:18 GMT -5
Tour clubs are the better choice for the Top 10% of the players. I think that's safe to say. They hit almost everything dead straight. No need to take players club.
It gets a little more interesting talking about difficulty balance when you look at it from the perspective of the rest of the field. For me - and i am right now a pretty poor player - player clubs play easier than tour clubs, by far. I yesterday played the tourney of the Hershey society and finished +2 over 4 rounds using tour clubs. I am never over par on a "normal" course (not tricked up TGC! style") using player clubs.
I heard this from a lot of guys in this thread. That means in order to be competitive (making cuts) you are almost forced to use player clubs - even if you don't like it from a gameplay perspective. Imo Tour clubs offer so much more immersion of playing real golf than the player clubs. Player clubs feel more like a video game.
Player club defendants say "nobody should be forced to use a certain club". That might be right. But the difficulty balance right now in a way "forces" a lot of guys into using player clubs - unless you don't care, where you end up. And most of us will care - otherwise we wouldn't be playing here in a competitive environment.
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Post by xraylucy on Jul 10, 2017 3:52:39 GMT -5
P/P/S....
Played 8 rounds so far and haven't never hit those once.
Straight is no problem but i have a consistent SF swing. (slow/fast)
Last round went in 92 strokes. Will continue to practice but when week 42 hits i might play the tour events using the players set.
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