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Post by blackaces13 on Jul 14, 2015 17:23:42 GMT -5
Maybe someone can explain to me, or help me understand, why is it bad that the wind update might be in effect middle tourney? Because let's say a guy who waits for favorable conditions found them the day before the wind went "live". He plays all 4 rounds in 0-5 MPH winds. Then today they lock the wind so for anyone playing after that date they will face two rounds of 15-18, one with 5-9, and a final round of 20+. Obviously that's not fair. I read that this is not how it works, and that the locked wind will only apply to tournaments created after the wind goes live, but I don't know for sure.
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Post by Brighttail on Jul 14, 2015 17:45:00 GMT -5
Maybe someone can explain to me, or help me understand, why is it bad that the wind update might be in effect middle tourney? Because let's say a guy who waits for favorable conditions found them the day before the wind went "live". He plays all 4 rounds in 0-5 MPH winds. Then today they lock the wind so for anyone playing after that date they will face two rounds of 15-18, one with 5-9, and a final round of 20+. Obviously that's not fair. I read that this is not how it works, and that the locked wind will only apply to tournaments created after the wind goes live, but I don't know for sure. You pretty much nailed it. I know HB said the wind update was supposed to be today but I haven't heard that it actually happened.
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Post by Mitchblue on Jul 14, 2015 17:47:03 GMT -5
Maybe someone can explain to me, or help me understand, why is it bad that the wind update might be in effect middle tourney? Because let's say a guy who waits for favorable conditions found them the day before the wind went "live". He plays all 4 rounds in 0-5 MPH winds. Then today they lock the wind so for anyone playing after that date they will face two rounds of 15-18, one with 5-9, and a final round of 20+. Obviously that's not fair. I read that this is not how it works, and that the locked wind will only apply to tournaments created after the wind goes live, but I don't know for sure. It's not fair because other's wait for wind. If others didn't do that it wouldn't be a problem. I know that sounds simple or "that was never going to happen Mitch.." but the fairness is the ones waiting around.
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Post by blackaces13 on Jul 14, 2015 18:06:22 GMT -5
You're never going to stop people from exploiting a bad system, you can only fix the system.
You asked how the wind being locked in the middle of a tournament would affect the tournament, I told you how. Your thoughts on the sportsmanship of those who decide to exploit the system are not germane to the question.
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Post by Mitchblue on Jul 14, 2015 18:14:57 GMT -5
You're never going to stop people from exploiting a bad system, you can only fix the system. You asked how the wind being locked in the middle of a tournament would affect the tournament, I told you how. Your thoughts on the sportsmanship of those who decide to exploit the system are not germane to the question. It is in a way. If people played "fair" then no one would worry. I haven't heard one good reason of waiting for wind. All I hear is "To compete you need to.." Rather do the right thing and finish last than the wrong.. Sorry if it doesn't go with what you asked, directly, but I get tired of others talking about the damn wind.
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Post by Brighttail on Jul 14, 2015 18:21:48 GMT -5
At this point, I had a friend who hasn't played the tournament yet, check round one. The wind there was the same as the practice course so it looks like for now wind has NOT been turned on.
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Post by blackaces13 on Jul 14, 2015 18:29:12 GMT -5
You're never going to stop people from exploiting a bad system, you can only fix the system. You asked how the wind being locked in the middle of a tournament would affect the tournament, I told you how. Your thoughts on the sportsmanship of those who decide to exploit the system are not germane to the question. It is in a way. If people played "fair" then no one would worry. I haven't heard one good reason of waiting for wind. All I hear is "To compete you need to.." Rather do the right thing and finish last than the wrong.. Sorry if it doesn't go with what you asked, directly, but I get tired of others talking about the damn wind. If no one broke the law, we wouldn't need police, so what? You haven't heard one "good" reason? People wait because it enables them to play in easier conditions which allow them to shoot better scores, very simple. (This is the part where you tell me that if they didn't wait, then it wouldn't be a problem, then I again mention the fact that they DO wait, and they will continue to wait as long as it provides an advantage, and until the wind is fixed there will be no way to stop it, because I'm not interested in discussing a hypothetical fantasy world, I'm discussing reality.) People talk about it because it greatly affects the outcome of tournaments, IN PRACTICE. It's all pretty straightforward, I don't understand your confusion.
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Post by Mitchblue on Jul 14, 2015 18:50:19 GMT -5
It is in a way. If people played "fair" then no one would worry. I haven't heard one good reason of waiting for wind. All I hear is "To compete you need to.." Rather do the right thing and finish last than the wrong.. Sorry if it doesn't go with what you asked, directly, but I get tired of others talking about the damn wind. If no one broke the law, we wouldn't need police, so what? You haven't heard one "good" reason? People wait because it enables them to play in easier conditions which allow them to shoot better scores, very simple. (This is the part where you tell me that if they didn't wait, then it wouldn't be a problem, then I again mention the fact that they DO wait, and they will continue to wait as long as it provides an advantage, and until the wind is fixed there will be no way to stop it, because I'm not interested in discussing a hypothetical fantasy world, I'm discussing reality.) People talk about it because it greatly affects the outcome of tournaments, IN PRACTICE. It's all pretty straightforward, I don't understand your confusion. It's not a good reason. As you said "gaming the system." How can gaming the system be a good reason. I guess others just rather win regardless the way they do it..The way I look at it, when I play, some times I get high winds while others are getting low winds. Then times others are get the high winds. I didn't come here to argue and I'm certainly not the only person around here think it's wrong. Is winning that important?
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Post by Brighttail on Jul 14, 2015 19:07:47 GMT -5
If no one broke the law, we wouldn't need police, so what? You haven't heard one "good" reason? People wait because it enables them to play in easier conditions which allow them to shoot better scores, very simple. (This is the part where you tell me that if they didn't wait, then it wouldn't be a problem, then I again mention the fact that they DO wait, and they will continue to wait as long as it provides an advantage, and until the wind is fixed there will be no way to stop it, because I'm not interested in discussing a hypothetical fantasy world, I'm discussing reality.) People talk about it because it greatly affects the outcome of tournaments, IN PRACTICE. It's all pretty straightforward, I don't understand your confusion. It's not a good reason. As you said "gaming the system." How can gaming the system be a good reason. I guess others just rather win regardless the way they do it..The way I look at it, when I play, some times I get high winds while others are getting low winds. Then times others are get the high winds. I didn't come here to argue and I'm certainly not the only person around here think it's wrong. Is winning that important? Your argument is a moral one and not a legal one. Is it morally right to wind wait? It isn't against the rules so that part of the argument is moot. Morally we can bring other things in to the argument. You can say, in real life no one can wind wait. Well you can also say that no one can hit flop shots like they do in the game. No one in real life can loft up a 3iron and have it stop quicker than a normal 7 iron. None of these are illegal and yet I'm sure everyone has played a flop shot in a way that real life pros never could. Basically your opinion is no one should wind wait. We get that. We also get that this is a competition. Of course it is, we submit scorecards, get points and money attributed to our accounts and are ranked accordingly. So it isn't about winning it is optimizing the game within the rules to allow us the best chance we have to succeed. If that means waiting until the winds aren't 18mph, so be it. Your opinion is that this is wrong. My opinion is anyone who doesn't do this and wishes to remain competitive is making a very silly error as they are intentionally setting themselves up not to play on a level playing field. Conclusion, when the wind update is turned on and finally working as intended, most of this will be moot.
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Post by Mitchblue on Jul 14, 2015 19:17:06 GMT -5
It's not a good reason. As you said "gaming the system." How can gaming the system be a good reason. I guess others just rather win regardless the way they do it..The way I look at it, when I play, some times I get high winds while others are getting low winds. Then times others are get the high winds. I didn't come here to argue and I'm certainly not the only person around here think it's wrong. Is winning that important? Your argument is a moral one and not a legal one. Is it morally right to wind wait? It isn't against the rules so that part of the argument is moot. Morally we can bring other things in to the argument. You can say, in real life no one can wind wait. Well you can also say that no one can hit flop shots like they do in the game. No one in real life can loft up a 3iron and have it stop quicker than a normal 7 iron. None of these are illegal and yet I'm sure everyone has played a flop shot in a way that real life pros never could. Basically your opinion is no one should wind wait. We get that. We also get that this is a competition. Of course it is, we submit scorecards, get points and money attributed to our accounts and are ranked accordingly. So it isn't about winning it is optimizing the game within the rules to allow us the best chance we have to succeed. If that means waiting until the winds aren't 18mph, so be it. Your opinion is that this is wrong. My opinion is anyone who doesn't do this and wishes to remain competitive is making a very silly error as they are intentionally setting themselves up not to play on a level playing field. Conclusion, when the wind update is turned on and finally working as intended, most of this will be moot. Yes, I understand it's a morale. But for me, that's the only way to go. And yes, the wind update will stop this.I hope. Cheers..
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Post by Brighttail on Jul 14, 2015 19:44:18 GMT -5
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Post by acidflashback on Jul 17, 2015 3:30:29 GMT -5
CBF reading 18 pages - I assume the wind lock for tournaments has been turned off still?
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Post by Pubknight on Jul 17, 2015 8:07:11 GMT -5
CBF reading 18 pages - I assume the wind lock for tournaments has been turned off still? yes, latest news (from HB_Keith) on HB's forums indicates turning it back on 'sometime next week'.
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Post by edi_vedder on Jul 20, 2015 19:35:44 GMT -5
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