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Post by HeMan1202 on Feb 5, 2016 13:58:37 GMT -5
#4- Its not supposed to be viewed as a public drug testing event, lol, Golf games over the years hav been littered with with ppl using all sorts of things to gain an advantage. It wud be naive to think nobody trys to or actively cheats...so i wud see it as something to show how clean we all are and it wud be great entertainment for all of us. Last time i checked, people are innocent until proven guilty, not the other way around. More to the point, let's say someone is cheating, do you think they'd be dumb enough to cheat when they know they are being watched? Shame really, your first 3 suggestions were reasonable but you went one too far What if you took out the "transparency" part and just focused on the entertainment part. Lots if players do it already. TGCT could even have a channel dedicated to tournament play.
We would need to get Twitch to fix their broadcasting banner though.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 5, 2016 13:59:35 GMT -5
I think #3 needs implemented the most. There is a very specific case that I find very troubling and yet that person is still here after a season one months long penalty.
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Post by smurfblade88 on Feb 5, 2016 14:02:31 GMT -5
#2 I thinks its a huge advantage. Iv heard many top 50 players over the last few weeks talk about how they use ghosts in tourny to see what shot to hit and where to hit it, ghosts also provide info on numbers to hit which in my opinion is wrong. #4 maybe an option of stream or record and upload to youtube can be provided. How do ghosts provide numbers? Are you talking about watching a replay vs. just watching the ghost balls? I'd be in favor of HB having an option to not allow replays of shots until all players have hit. I wouldn't want to take that option completely away - if someone gets a hole in one or some other great shot I like to go back and watch it. Sure, maybe upload the video. But making it a requirement still feels wrong. Some people are just private. Some don't even use this forum. Turning top 20 into a voyeur requirement is odd. Plus, plenty of them stream anyways so there are always options to watch. With re: to ghosts as outlined by someone above, it gives exact numbers of how far a shot was hit and the roll out...thats just wrong! I dont think streaming 1 or 4 rounds every 10 weeks wud be too much. It cud be streamed by TGCTLive and a weekly show cud be made. It wud be great.
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Post by ABU_Bear on Feb 5, 2016 14:05:31 GMT -5
Need an option of Payne Stewart knickers for my golfer...that would make TGCT AWESOME!!!!
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Post by SmilingGoats on Feb 5, 2016 14:23:29 GMT -5
1) Tournament courses revealing- I'd like to see courses for future events held back until about 5 or 6 days before they start. Currently we know weeks and sometimes months before an event what course we will play and this leads to course mapping, where some players will play the arse of a course in the weeks before it and know the course inside out before playing the event. I know its not against any rules, i just don't like it. We can discuss this one. The only downside I really see is that there have been a few isolated occurrences, albeit pretty rare, where a course has gotten past the selector and rangers without issue but found to have some type of issue by the populace. If this occurs enough in advance, we can sub the course with the current setup. The other issue is that this would give an advantage to the rangers and admins who will know well in advance what courses are on slate. 2) Ghost use- I'd like to see the removal of ghosts for TGCTours events as in my opinion there are far too many people who rely on them to show them the shots to be playing. Maybe if it could be allowed that u can only play with other live players who are in the event that may be ok as a compromise. I am on record as having said that if HB gives us this option, I'm all for preventing the use of ghost balls. But until we get the option to disable them for tourneys, we can't/don't want to have to enforce it. 3) One strike and ur out policy for cheaters- I'd like to see a one strike and your out policy for anyone caught breaking the rules re: Straight shooting, multiple accounts etc. The current system encourages people to try things once and see if you get away with it too much for me. This seems cut and dry but it really isn't. People, especially new people, don't always read or understand the rules. Sometimes they are ignorant to what is going on and with others we just can't fully prove malicious intent. We do our best to be fair in every situation but considering each situation on its own because it is never black and white. 4) Streaming rounds spot checks: I'd like to see a rule come in where if ur a top 10 or 20 WGR player there are random events where 1 or 2 players have to stream 1 or all rounds of their tournament, for the sake of transparency and entertainment I can see the entertainment value of this but not sure I'm ready to make it a requirement. I think the top 10 players get plenty of scrutiny as is. Their ghost balls are used more in practice rounds and tourney rounds then any others.
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Post by Wildrover on Feb 5, 2016 14:29:27 GMT -5
Hi All, Just thought id share a few thoughts of mine that I think would make TGCTours a better experience. Note: I am aware that some things aren't possible and would require help from HB. 1) Tournament courses revealing- I'd like to see courses for future events held back until about 5 or 6 days before they start. Currently we know weeks and sometimes months before an event what course we will play and this leads to course mapping, where some players will play the arse of a course in the weeks before it and know the course inside out before playing the event. I know its not against any rules, i just don't like it. 2) Ghost use- I'd like to see the removal of ghosts for TGCTours events as in my opinion there are far too many people who rely on them to show them the shots to be playing. Maybe if it could be allowed that u can only play with other live players who are in the event that may be ok as a compromise. 3) One strike and ur out policy for cheaters- I'd like to see a one strike and your out policy for anyone caught breaking the rules re: Straight shooting, multiple accounts etc. The current system encourages people to try things once and see if you get away with it too much for me. 4) Streaming rounds spot checks: I'd like to see a rule come in where if ur a top 10 or 20 WGR player there are random events where 1 or 2 players have to stream 1 or all rounds of their tournament, for the sake of transparency and entertainment These are just a few things id like to see, im well aware some cant or wont happen but none the less there my opinions. Feel free to leave some of ur own or comment on mine. I agree with 1.. Although nobody plays the arse of a course more than u smurf that being said your point is a good 1.. I strongly agree with 2... Ghosts should NOT be allowed IMO in tourney play such as tgctours events,although your alternative solution around this is practical. I strongly agree with 3 too... If you have the mindset of wanting to cheat by using a straight shooter etc in the first place,then it seriously questions that kind of mindset changing totally..I would have agreed with 4 but I'm not likely to be in the top 20 of the WGR anytime soon so boooooo to that 1
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Post by yaters on Feb 5, 2016 14:30:30 GMT -5
Those are all good answers SmilingGoats With respect to revealing courses....is there already a rule about a course being used on the tour of the person that created it? Just my opinion, but if you restricted the time people knew what course was selected to 5 or 6 days, people will still practice it a lot. Not sure how that solves any problems.
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Post by Lowenberger on Feb 5, 2016 14:40:17 GMT -5
How do ghosts provide numbers? Are you talking about watching a replay vs. just watching the ghost balls? I'd be in favor of HB having an option to not allow replays of shots until all players have hit. I wouldn't want to take that option completely away - if someone gets a hole in one or some other great shot I like to go back and watch it. Sure, maybe upload the video. But making it a requirement still feels wrong. Some people are just private. Some don't even use this forum. Turning top 20 into a voyeur requirement is odd. Plus, plenty of them stream anyways so there are always options to watch. With re: to ghosts as outlined by someone above, it gives exact numbers of how far a shot was hit and the roll out...thats just wrong! I dont think streaming 1 or 4 rounds every 10 weeks wud be too much. It cud be streamed by TGCTLive and a weekly show cud be made. It wud be great. Its definitely an advantage, although there are enough variables with lofting clubs up to 3 times that can mess you up following ghosts. If we got rid of ghost balls, I'm worried I'd lose interest in TGCT to tell you the truth... they give the sense that the golf course is alive with other people on it and think it might feel stale without that.
If we outlaw ghosts, I think you'd have to outlaw playing live with other people. I think its a much bigger advantage if two live players played together and were able to discuss their shots, club selection, rollouts, etc.
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Post by smurfblade88 on Feb 5, 2016 14:56:07 GMT -5
Hi All, Just thought id share a few thoughts of mine that I think would make TGCTours a better experience. Note: I am aware that some things aren't possible and would require help from HB. 1) Tournament courses revealing- I'd like to see courses for future events held back until about 5 or 6 days before they start. Currently we know weeks and sometimes months before an event what course we will play and this leads to course mapping, where some players will play the arse of a course in the weeks before it and know the course inside out before playing the event. I know its not against any rules, i just don't like it. 2) Ghost use- I'd like to see the removal of ghosts for TGCTours events as in my opinion there are far too many people who rely on them to show them the shots to be playing. Maybe if it could be allowed that u can only play with other live players who are in the event that may be ok as a compromise. 3) One strike and ur out policy for cheaters- I'd like to see a one strike and your out policy for anyone caught breaking the rules re: Straight shooting, multiple accounts etc. The current system encourages people to try things once and see if you get away with it too much for me. 4) Streaming rounds spot checks: I'd like to see a rule come in where if ur a top 10 or 20 WGR player there are random events where 1 or 2 players have to stream 1 or all rounds of their tournament, for the sake of transparency and entertainment These are just a few things id like to see, im well aware some cant or wont happen but none the less there my opinions. Feel free to leave some of ur own or comment on mine. I agree with 1.. Although nobody plays the arse of a course more than u smurf that being said your point is a good 1.. I strongly agree with 2... Ghosts should NOT be allowed IMO in tourney play such as tgctours events,although your alternative solution around this is practical. I strongly agree with 3 too... If you have the mindset of wanting to cheat by using a straight shooter etc in the first place,then it seriously question that kind of mindset changing totally..I would have agreed with 4 but I'm not likely to be in the top 20 of the WGR anytime soon so boooooo to that 1 I play my nxt weeks course about twice id say in the week before if i havnt played it before....tbh, id rather it the course not be released until 1 day before but tat will lead to registration issues. The top 20 thing wud be gud craic.
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Post by smurfblade88 on Feb 5, 2016 14:57:52 GMT -5
With re: to ghosts as outlined by someone above, it gives exact numbers of how far a shot was hit and the roll out...thats just wrong! I dont think streaming 1 or 4 rounds every 10 weeks wud be too much. It cud be streamed by TGCTLive and a weekly show cud be made. It wud be great. Its definitely an advantage, although there are enough variables with lofting clubs up to 3 times that can mess you up following ghosts. If we got rid of ghost balls, I'm worried I'd lose interest in TGCT to tell you the truth... they give the sense that the golf course is alive with other people on it and think it might feel stale without that.
If we outlaw ghosts, I think you'd have to outlaw playing live with other people. I think its a much bigger advantage if two live players played together and were able to discuss their shots, club selection, rollouts, etc.
Ud lose interest if there were no ghosts allowed in tournys? Really? Its such a small thing to me...id hav no problem with them going altogether, lol
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Post by boomboom on Feb 5, 2016 15:02:11 GMT -5
1. No: Clear case of I can't so neither can you. Total BS suggestion. Mapping is just a lame BS reason as well. Come tourney time the wind could be doing anything and mapping is useless. WTF is mapping anyway. Are you suggesting someone is able to map the 2 million plus possibilities per hole.? 2. Only if HBS gives it as an option when setting up the tournament and nothing else, none of this on your honour BS, and shut them all off, not limit it to anything, no playing with friends either, if your going to be paranoid delusional, play by yourself. 3. Define cheating as game enhancing manipulation and exploitation only and yes, and maybe. Some people think calculators are cheating. Distance charts are cheating. Lofted 3 irons are cheating, flopping is cheating. You obviously feel practice is cheating and playing with friends is cheating. Is submitting an incorrect scorecard cheating, chipping on the green for someone new, Equipment malfunctions or improper setup etc. Not everyone has even remotely similar definitions of cheating. What happens if the api burps, the game burps, someone plays and the scorecard does not show up, are they cheating as well?
How exactly are they caught as well, and caught doing what exactly. Thought we had an API, is there no api or is it broken as well. What exactly is being suggested people are doing, again I thought we had an api for straight shooting, why is this a problem? Who's been caught cheating and what did they do precisely that enhanced their game, are they still here? So define cheating first, and maybe I'm with you.
4. No. Well it's rather presumptuous on your part to assume everyone is playing with power house internet services. Not every PC is capable of streaming and playing very well either. However in any event, What exactly do you hope to see here in any event, again I thought we had an api is it broken or something.
Why is there so much concern with cheating, is the API broken? If it's broken or not working then tell everyone. I'm under the impression there were safe guards to prevent cheating, why are so many people chatting about cheating and convinced it's happening. What exactly is being suggested they are doing if they are not straight shooting. Curious minds want to know here.
You say the suggestions are to enhance, but they are really all about organizing a lynch mob for some kind of witch hunt and removing the fun completely from the game. Sorry I fail to see much enhancement going on here.
Just let me in on what you think people are doing and how they are cheating and I'm with you. But this looks like suggestions from someone convinced everyone is cheating, with no idea how they are cheating, or even if they are cheating, just assuming they are cheating and nothing is in place obviously to prevent cheating. Which brings me back to what exactly is your definition of cheating.
This is just a fun thing I do on Saturday morning and sometimes into Sunday. Play my 4 rounds and move on to more designing and practicing next weeks course through the week and some more designing. This is not life, the money is not real. Don't remove the fun from me so you can be convinced you are the best there is and anyone better is cheating.
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Post by Wildrover on Feb 5, 2016 15:09:09 GMT -5
Its definitely an advantage, although there are enough variables with lofting clubs up to 3 times that can mess you up following ghosts. If we got rid of ghost balls, I'm worried I'd lose interest in TGCT to tell you the truth... they give the sense that the golf course is alive with other people on it and think it might feel stale without that.
If we outlaw ghosts, I think you'd have to outlaw playing live with other people. I think its a much bigger advantage if two live players played together and were able to discuss their shots, club selection, rollouts, etc.
Ud lose interest if there were no ghosts allowed in tournys? Really? Its such a small thing to me...id hav no problem with them going altogether, lol You and I could make a remake of the auld classic 'ghostbusters'... "I AINT AFRAID OF NO GHOSTS" how apt!!
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Post by smurfblade88 on Feb 5, 2016 15:20:52 GMT -5
1. No: Clear case of I can't so neither can you. Total BS suggestion. Mapping is just a lame BS reason as well. Come tourney time the wind could be doing anything and mapping is useless. WTF is mapping anyway. Are you suggesting someone is able to map the 2 million plus possibilities per hole.? 2. Only if HBS gives it as an option when setting up the tournament and nothing else, none of this on your honour BS, and shut them all off, not limit it to anything, no playing with friends either, if your going to be paranoid delusional, play by yourself. 3. Define cheating as game enhancing manipulation and exploitation only and yes, and maybe. Some people think calculators are cheating. Distance charts are cheating. Lofted 3 irons are cheating, flopping is cheating. You obviously feel practice is cheating and playing with friends is cheating. Is submitting an incorrect scorecard cheating, chipping on the green for someone new, Equipment malfunctions or improper setup etc. Not everyone has even remotely similar definitions of cheating. What happens if the api burps, the game burps, someone plays and the scorecard does not show up, are they cheating as well? How exactly are they caught as well, and caught doing what exactly. Thought we had an API, is there no api or is it broken as well. What exactly is being suggested people are doing, again I thought we had an api for straight shooting, why is this a problem? Who's been caught cheating and what did they do precisely that enhanced their game, are they still here? So define cheating first, and maybe I'm with you. 4. No. Well it's rather presumptuous on your part to assume everyone is playing with power house internet services. Not every PC is capable of streaming and playing very well either. However in any event, What exactly do you hope to see here in any event, again I thought we had an api is it broken or something. Why is there so much concern with cheating, is the API broken? If it's broken or not working then tell everyone. I'm under the impression there were safe guards to prevent cheating, why are so many people chatting about cheating and convinced it's happening. What exactly is being suggested they are doing if they are not straight shooting. Curious minds want to know here. You say the suggestions are to enhance, but they are really all about organizing a lynch mob for some kind of witch hunt and removing the fun completely from the game. Sorry I fail to see much enhancement going on here. Just let me in on what you think people are doing and how they are cheating and I'm with you. But this looks like suggestions from someone convinced everyone is cheating, with no idea how they are cheating, or even if they are cheating, just assuming they are cheating and nothing is in place obviously to prevent cheating. Which brings me back to what exactly is your definition of cheating. This is just a fun thing I do on Saturday morning and sometimes into Sunday. Play my 4 rounds and move on to more designing and practicing next weeks course through the week and some more designing. This is not life, the money is not real. Don't remove the fun from me so you can be convinced you are the best there is and anyone better is cheating. Seems as if Iv touched a few nerves with u Boom boom, lol 1) What exactly are u talkin about? what can some do that I cant? Wind makes mapping useless and then u ask whats mapping? Ignorance really is bliss. 2) Obviously this has to come from HB, i wudn want a TST style system where u relyin on others not to cheat. 3) I think most people on here understand cheating to be gaining an unfair advantage by breakin the rules....thats pretty clear and simple. 4) Again, as stated above, Its for transparency and entertainment purposes. And again as stated above If people cant stream they cud upload a vid to youtube and maybe TGCTLive cud host streams or youtube highlights shows, it wud be great imo. Nobody is assumin any individuals are cheating but as stated above golf games of the past have been littered with shady dealings of many kind so to show how open and transparent we are here at TGCTours we cud do this for entertainment reasons too. I understand u play this for fun but this is organised competition. If u want to hav fun, carefree ruleless golf jus play normal rounds every week. U shudn play in organised competition if u cant handle the idea of rules and policies & procedures for the competition. How exactly is any of my suggestions going to ruin ur fun? U seem to give off the impression tat if theres scrutiny on fair play and entertainment for the masses that somehow hinders ur fun? Strange
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Post by Deleted on Feb 5, 2016 15:26:39 GMT -5
2) if you rely on hbs to eliminate the ghost balls, surely they could implement a turn based only option as well.
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Post by yaters on Feb 5, 2016 15:28:06 GMT -5
I agree with 1.. Although nobody plays the arse of a course more than u smurf that being said your point is a good 1.. I strongly agree with 2... Ghosts should NOT be allowed IMO in tourney play such as tgctours events,although your alternative solution around this is practical. I strongly agree with 3 too... If you have the mindset of wanting to cheat by using a straight shooter etc in the first place,then it seriously question that kind of mindset changing totally..I would have agreed with 4 but I'm not likely to be in the top 20 of the WGR anytime soon so boooooo to that 1 I play my nxt weeks course about twice id say in the week before if i havnt played it before....tbh, id rather it the course not be released until 1 day before but tat will lead to registration issues. The top 20 thing wud be gud craic. haha - what?
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