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Post by paulus on Aug 13, 2019 18:04:51 GMT -5
Seems the force pro debate still has some legs (despite it being pretty much done AFAICS)... nonetheless I thought this post drove to the central tension... No matter which way you slice it, we could pick, at best, two of three values: fairness, club-choice, cross-platform. No combination of two of those three is wrong. Ideally we could have all three, but TGC2019 doesn't make that possible.
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Post by titaneddie on Aug 13, 2019 18:18:06 GMT -5
Paul can i suggest a name change to....PollUs?
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Post by B.Smooth13 on Aug 13, 2019 18:44:47 GMT -5
I utterly and completely disavow the premise of this question. Values are not mutually exclusive, not impossible things to hold dear apart from each other. No interest is debating the virtue of values here, that’s an endless rabbit hole, but this is not a fair question to pose if the expectation is to get meaningful results, IMO.
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Post by paulus on Aug 13, 2019 19:04:44 GMT -5
if the expectation is to get meaningful results It's certainly not my expectation As mentioned in the OP, this debate is done & done for me. This poll is just for the craic really...
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Post by ErixonStone on Aug 13, 2019 21:48:09 GMT -5
I utterly and completely disavow the premise of this question. Values are not mutually exclusive, not impossible things to hold dear apart from each other. No interest is debating the virtue of values here, that’s an endless rabbit hole, but this is not a fair question to pose if the expectation is to get meaningful results, IMO. I don't know how much debate there could be, and there are no wrong answers. This seems like just a survey - almost like a personality test you might take when starting a new job. I am fairly confident that "fairness" will be valued the most - although not universally - but it'll be interesting to see whether club-choice or cross-platform garners the most votes.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Aug 13, 2019 21:53:50 GMT -5
Determination.
Dude you are something. Did you grow up on the losing soccer team or something? Maybe last to be picked to play dodgeball?
A for effort though.
Life is not fair. Stop.
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Post by ezzinomilonga on Aug 14, 2019 3:26:42 GMT -5
I utterly and completely disavow the premise of this question. Values are not mutually exclusive, not impossible things to hold dear apart from each other. No interest is debating the virtue of values here, that’s an endless rabbit hole, but this is not a fair question to pose if the expectation is to get meaningful results, IMO. Your comment is the perfect reduction in words of what I have think reading the options. Is obvious that fairness is the first thing. Always. The problem of this poll is that it comes after days and days of debates and honestly I think is everything pretty clear. We're stucked and I'm not so sure that other debates will change something. But we did what we should do. We gave a lot of feedbacks to the admins about every side of the problem. Probably now we can just wait. Knowing that we can't have in every case a solution good enough for everybody here. Is sad, but is true. The only think I wish to say now is that, if we want a little of fairness related to the use of master clubs, the first thing to do absolutely, is to start to punish REALLY the unfair players, giving definitive ban after two pulled scores. Especially who wants to compete at the better levels, maybe with the perspective to create a new profile and play a q-school everytime it will be enough motivated at least to try, to play fairly. As a secondary thought..and I know this could be see as wrong..but I wish to see huge disrespect on these guys. Not necessarily with cheating accusations..i know this can't be said..but isolating this people. And treating them as the clown they are. They must to know that our disrespect is simply endless. And that every trophy they win, means more or less like what my dogs leaves under the trees. If we want that this thing ends, soon or later, we need a civil revolution, first. You must not accept this players in the community. Even if they are nice guys. Cause I can't think nothing more disrespectful that what they are doing here. By months. This is what I think. I know I can be wrong, but I can't see other ways to change this thing, even considering that for hb this thing is not considered as a problem at all (I have read the discussions there). We are alone and we should be united if we want to fight and win this thing.
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Post by Celtic Wolf on Aug 14, 2019 4:31:49 GMT -5
How about we leave the admins to it, we've filled in the survey they've got the results back and will put something in place for next season.
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Post by sandsaver01 on Aug 14, 2019 7:31:22 GMT -5
This false choice about fairness is kind of unfair. I grew up in an era before Participation Trophies, and I recognize that life is not fair. A lot of people will always be better than me at this game, and at life as well. Heck, There are a lot of Xbox Masters players in CC-D that kick my PS4 using a$$ regularly. The TGC Tours are not INTENTIONALLY unfair (if they are in fact unfair). Maybe we should just let the PC players decide the Masters vs Pro issue, they presumably have less of a dog in the fight.
I know this post might cause some panty-bunching but that is not my intent.
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