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[ezzinomilonga]

By the way..is really weird to realize that we could see, with a bit of luck, some incredible fight in these Finals, if Golden State don't quit in game 5. And i don'think they will. If Toronto want to win in 5 games, they have to "kill" Golden State in the field, i think (and hope).
And all this is happening just cause the guys from the bay suffered a really huge amount of injuries. I know that, at this point, i should to give to Toronto some more credit and to believe that they could win even without this situation...but honestly i can't.
Obviously is all different now, cause Toronto have full faith that is really possible to win, but i still believe that without the injury of KT, game 3 would be a different story. And the whole series too. Guys as Lowry or Danny Green are very good players, but i saw them too often struggles when the ball starts to burn...especially when they don't plays at home.

But now is just beautiful. I'm waiting for Monday's game desperately. And if Golden State win game 5, a game 7 is just behind the corner.

They should be 3 great matches.

[boffo]

Jun 8, 2019 4:04:42 GMT -5 ezzinomilonga said:

boffo (i can't imagine what is happening in Toronto, right NOW. I imagine it will be some pure madness )

Seems likely.  Toronto is very much a hockey city first, second, and third but they do love supporting their other teams when they're doing well.  In this case however the Raptors also have the benefit of being the only team in Canada so pretty much the whole country has jumped on the bandwagon.  There are outdoor viewing parties for the games going on in most of the major cities across the country.  Of course most of the people attending them had never watched a basketball game up until a week or so ago, but I'm sure the Raptors and NBA as a whole will gain some new long term fans out of it.

[LKeet6]

This is going to G7.

I think Toronto can win G5 if they play absolutely amazing, but gsw will be at 100%, of that you can be sure.

So yeah, most likely G7.

[TimB]

Jun 8, 2019 9:31:06 GMT -5 boffo said:

pretty much the whole country has jumped on the bandwagon.   most of the people attending them had never watched a basketball game up until a week or so ago

lol

I'm guilty of this. Never really liked the sport.

Found myself watching the 2'nd and 3'rd quarters, couldn't stay awake for the rest (yeah I'm old so what)...so I pvr'rd the 4'th. Won't watch it now. Made the mistake of turning on the tv to a TO news station...oh well, pvring (to avoid commercials) The Canadian Open so will be watching that today

I've never watched a basketball game before, but yeah I'll probably watch the next game.

[ezzinomilonga]

I don't know what will be the conclusion of these Finals, but honestly the scenes i saw in the press conference after game 4, with the Golden State's director of basketball operations, reduced in tears speaking about KD's attitude and injury..and the faces and the voices of manager and teammates, it was something really "beautiful".
I was easily already awared that this team is one of the best in the game history, no matters what it will happen, but for a certain number of reasons i never really loved this team. But i must absolutely to appreciate how they're involved as a team in this dramatic situation. I really love when i can see humanity and empathy in the world of sport, that is too often a fake world, where it seems to be important just moneys and achievements...
Who knows..maybe this unlucky situation could help not only to realize an unvelievable come back in these finals (and if GS wins game 6, i'm not so sure that in a game 7 Toronto could ever wins...), but maybe also to keep away the end of this team (as we know it) for some other year.
I don't know. The only thing i know is that a final that could to seem destinated to be boring, now could become one of the more exciting i ever saw. I love this game...really.

[ezzinomilonga]

(i'll resurrect the old thread about NBA to answer, this time, just to not invade too much a thread extremely serious, as the BLM is, with other things)

theclv24 wow..it must be just amazing to have the chance to coach at the highest possible level in some sport.. It must be an experience absolutely crazy. A dream. I'm really happy you had this chance..and i hope you can have it again!

About Gigi and his american experience, i can share with you only some additional thought, from someone who obviously had never the chance to know him personally, based only on what i saw about him and his behavior on the field.

No counting the obvious traumatic first approach with the NBA (inside and outside the court, i suppose, especially for an italian guy), my impression has always been that he is that kind of player who, to make some difference and to result the determinant player he can/wants/needs to be, he really needs to feel some confidence around him. Especially from his teammates.

He seems to me also that kind of guy so much involved in the destiny of his team, someone who cares so much about the idea to help his teammates, more than about the "simple" idea to win, that to play only few minutes, to stay out in the most important moment, i could bet it torments him constantly with the only result to ruin also those few minutes in which he could demonstrate to deserve some space. And this would drive him into an endless sick loop. I think is more or less what happened to him at Detroit and, probably in some minor (but even worst, for absurd) measure, at Boston. Because at Boston he probably suffered cause he had the feeling to really deserve more space. But well..

Mine is just a speculative thought with no solid basis at all, of course, but also considering how much he was slowly improving at Boston, finding some rythm and confidence i'm still convinced that, insisting, he would be a good role player in the NBA.
Although some obvious limit for that level, especially on the phisical side of the defence.

Then, i definitely think he decided to return in Europe, instead to follow the instinct to insist, because he was missing too much exactly that feeling to be important for his team.
His results seems to testify he made the right decision. I'm sure that if he solved his issues with injuries, with Messina who knows him really well,in Milano he could to explode again.

And yes..the european teams are mainly full of aged ex-NBA medium level players..or undrafted good ex-college players ,more or less in their prime.
But, really often, these second kind of players, especially if they are backcourt players, are incredibly strong, but they never seems to be part of their teams..they collects an outrageous amount of shots every match, obviously at least the half of these totally forced, cause their first (if not only) idea is that not only they can win a match all alone, but adding the idea that "now i must show to these Europeans how to play basket". You can recognize easily these guys cause they changes almost a team per season
They are all little Marburys

For this reason, at least in Italy (where the rules about the not Italian players are quite strict by some year, to tutelate the national team they said...with pretty comic and hypocrite results visible every week), as in many other countries, the choice of the Americans is absolutely decisive for the fortunes of a team.

But also looking at the Euroleague's teams, are really few the teams who have the money and the "charme" to result in some way attractive for the really strong american players.
I also think that, really often, even for what i explained about backourt players, what makes the difference between to win or not a title, is the level of your Power Forwards and Centers. If you have a decent rotation on these roles, your chances increases drastically, especially because, although some exception, is rare to find european centers who can defend phisically on their american counterparts.

In the end, i don't know if the level of the game in Europe, right now, is so good to deserve to be followed in America. After all, the old difference between American and European way about this beautiful game, is today very little. NBA in these last 25/30 years opened so much their doors to the foreign players that is becoming an almost perfect commistion between the 2 schools.

And, unfortunally, right now in Europe there are not anymore the various Ginobili, Danilovic, Marciulonis, Bodiroga, @!$#a, Myers, all the Yugoslavian or Greek school, people who made an unbelievable experience to watch the european basket. The best european players are already in NBA, with the exception of the serbian wizard Teodosic, De Colo, Hernandez..there was that prodigy of Doncic of course, but well...you understood what i mean.

[theclv24]

It was certainly a fascinating and maddening trip trying to make it in the NBA, but in the end for someone without playing experience it was just too much of a grind to try and stay and advance in the league, not really conducive to starting a family, so I voluntarily left. I certainly can't say I miss the endless hours in the office and gym (although of course Detroit got a fancy new downtown practice facility just a few years after I left  ), and having weekends and vacations (before 2020) is pretty nice, too.

I think you are right about Gigi, he definitely needed confidence to shoot the way he did in practice, and that was something he lacked. Except for those few good teams that have a good mix of the right kind of elite players and good role players, like your San Antonios and Golden States most recently, to be a confident player in the NBA you almost need to be borderline delusional. Speak it into existence, as Lavar Ball would say.

One thing I noticed after pouring through the Euroleague boxscores is how inconsistent some of the former NBA guys are in terms of how many games they play or how frequently. It seems like some of the guys would just disappear for 3, 4, 5 games. Other guys like Jerebko might put up 20 points one game and less than 5 for the next few games. I'm just seeing this on paper, of course, so I don't really know what's going on, but I can only imagine that if you are a fan of these teams, it has to be frustrating for those guys to be in and out, and never knowing what you will get from them. 

Whenever they return, I don't know if anything will change in terms of me watching Euroleague games, but I'll definitely have a better handle on what's going on.

[ezzinomilonga]

i noticed only now that the filter censored Gregor F u c k a
The funny thing is that, cause his pronounce, i never noticed before there was that word in his name!

[ezzinomilonga]

Probably, the lack of consistence is the main factor why a good number of american players sometimes goes in and out of the main rotations (and in and out from lot of teams in their career). Often, they are criticized for the image of a general lack of commitment on their teams they transmits outside and for not enough focus, if not "interest", to follow the coach's indications, both on defence and attack, in which some of them collects a really too big amount of isolations, especially on the most important possessions, something that here in Europe is still not particularly appreciated, although i can see this attitude slightly increased in these years. Lazy defensive rotations in not so little moments of the match (or in entire matches, especially in the national championships, often considered absolutely minor tounaments for who plays in Eurolega teams) does the rest.

I agree about the borderline character that probably is required (or it helps, at least) to be a good professional player in NBA. The psychological side of the game has been something always extremely interesting for me.
Looking from the outside, NBA players seems to be genuinely obsessed by the research of the alpha male..or by stupid things as how many weight you can lift. Another horrible attitude is that often they seems to consider the head coach as a dumba$$...and is one of the reasons why i criticized a great champ as Lebron or other champs. If the stronger players of a team gives this example, is not good at all.

Of course, to survive to the crazy competition of that environment, to resist to the great phisycal and psychological effort required every day to play at this level, i understand why to have (or to show, at least) this image of supermen alpha males it can be not only useful, but probably essential too.

[LKeet6]

I've watched the odd game of euroleague and the standard is good, in my opinion. Plenty of very skillful guard play.

My issue is I watch 82 raps games a season, and barely get to watch any of the other good team/players until the playoffs.

I've considered switching to only watching "big" raps games, so maybe 30-45 games, and then watching some of the other teams, but I feel like I'd be a "traitor" to my raps doing that 😂

I do follow a lot of the shows and podcasts, so I always know what's going on around the league.

[ezzinomilonga]

Jul 5, 2020 16:04:37 GMT -5 LKeet6 said:

I've watched the odd game of euroleague and the standard is good, in my opinion. Plenty of very skillful guard play.

My issue is I watch 82 raps games a season, and barely get to watch any of the other good team/players until the playoffs.

I've considered switching to only watching "big" raps games, so maybe 30-45 games, and then watching some of the other teams, but I feel like I'd be a "traitor" to my raps doing that 😂

I do follow a lot of the shows and podcasts, so I always know what's going on around the league.

The standard is more than good. Of course. I could also add that a pair of teams in these years played a basket even more enjoyable dor the purists of the game than the one showed by a good number of NBA teams (less isolations plays, more disciplin in the circulation of the ball and in the way to follow the called scheme etc..), i think about some edition of the Real Madrid and, in special way, the CSKA with Teodosic and DeColo. a backcourt simply illegal for that level. And, a team often underrated but beatuiful to watch as the Crvena Svezda of Beograd. But the level of Eurolega stays anyway enough below the NBA level, in rythm, phisical impact and intensity. This was what i meant.

[LKeet6]

Jul 6, 2020 2:34:42 GMT -5 ezzinomilonga said:

Jul 5, 2020 16:04:37 GMT -5 LKeet6 said:

I've watched the odd game of euroleague and the standard is good, in my opinion. Plenty of very skillful guard play.

My issue is I watch 82 raps games a season, and barely get to watch any of the other good team/players until the playoffs.

I've considered switching to only watching "big" raps games, so maybe 30-45 games, and then watching some of the other teams, but I feel like I'd be a "traitor" to my raps doing that 😂

I do follow a lot of the shows and podcasts, so I always know what's going on around the league.

The standard is more than good. Of course. I could also add that a pair of teams in these years played a basket even more enjoyable dor the purists of the game than the one showed by a good number of NBA teams (less isolations plays, more disciplin in the circulation of the ball and in the way to follow the called scheme etc..), i think about some edition of the Real Madrid and, in special way, the CSKA with Teodosic and DeColo. a backcourt simply illegal for that level. And, a team often underrated but beatuiful to watch as the Crvena Svezda of Beograd. But the level of Eurolega stays anyway enough below the NBA level, in rythm, phisical impact and intensity. This was what i meant.

I agree with you! Was just saying I think euroleague is a good standard 👍

Decolo "belongs" to the raptors. I've been following his progress and there's always rumours he might return to the raptors. He puts up very good numbers. Don't think he will ever come back now. Although, you never know, if Van vleet leaves, we would need a guard...

[ezzinomilonga]

I think DeColo could belong to that category of players that, having the chance to play in NBA, actually could prefer to stay in Europe..or to try and to return in a few months, as Teodosic, just to say about the most recent example.
After all, why to go/stay into a league that probably will never fully appreciate your skills because is always easier to highlight your flaws (and he has flaws in his game, for the NBA standard. Lot of flaws) than your strenghts, when in Europe you are considered a God of the game?
Furthermore, in NBA, for an european player is extremely important the context. There are team in which is simply impossible to find some rythm or an honest chance for them. Probably Toronto is one of the best places in which to try this experience, but i suspect that, even there, DeColo would start not only from the bench, but i have some doubt he would play the hot moments of the game.
There are players who accepts this kind of challenge and players who think is too much (or, anyway, it don't deserve the the effort and the risk for their careers).
I could understand this kind of choice.
For the same reason i'm not fully sure Gallinari will stay in NBA still for too long..especially if in the next free agency he shouldn't receive the wage he thinks to deserve in a competitive team as he wants.
Anyway..to stay in NBA and to find your own place, as on every thing in life, is required a very good amount of luck.

[LKeet6]

I agree Vinny.

You could've also added that as the euro game grows and grows, a star in Europe will earn considerably more than a 9-15 bench type guy.

I think decolo would struggle even to get regular playing time. So obviously he's doing the right thing staying in Europe.

Gallinari is an interesting one. I still think he can be an important player. Maybe even a starter! But we'll have to see. Injuries and trades keep derailing him trying to nail down a spot.

[ezzinomilonga]

Following the career of Danilo from his start as a teenager in Milano, i think he could be considered the perfect example about how much huge is the difference of requirements to play in NBA. And how much and why, for some player, is not necessarily always the best choice, to follow that way.

I firmly believe (and in a pair of interviews, when he has been questioned about it, he said he suspects it could be definitely true) the great amount of injuries he suffered is strictly related with the great amount of muscle mass he has been forced to add in the first years in NBA. If i look a pic of him when he was 16/17 years old, i see how much not "natural" is for him all that mass.

I think that in Europe he would have a "better" career, with no need to do all this work. And, maybe, after some year of play in Europe at the highest level, he would reach a certain status good enough to be drafted in NBA but with no need to do all that work in such a young age.
But, of course, with the if, but or maybe you can't make the history.