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Post by CuseHokie on Nov 18, 2019 21:14:30 GMT -5
I just wish we would allow the course to naturally challenge us and not have to use the highest wind on the highest firmness and highest speed. The course designers put dozens sometimes hundreds of hours into perfecting things. Allow that hard work to do it.
I can enjoy a -4 round when it’s a grind to score more than a -15 round where every putt is inside 10 feet and not breaking.
It’s the dumb luck, well executed shot not being rewarded that just is a waste of time.
Surprisingly, I’m doing okay in the PS4 final leaderboard at last check but there are just countless shots where you’re landing 10-12 yards short of the pin and the bounce and roll go past and sometimes off the green. That’s too far is it not?
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Post by GW_Hope on Nov 18, 2019 22:23:02 GMT -5
I can’t wait until we play an easy course like Augusta or I mean *******.
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Post by Generic_Casual on Nov 18, 2019 22:25:45 GMT -5
Do we actually consider anything "FUN"? I agree with Mitch about unlucky/lucky bounces/roll. I usually just chalk it up to I suck.
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Post by wadey1801 on Nov 19, 2019 5:33:21 GMT -5
I think the course selections are dumb. Take this week for example. A mediocre PGA event and we're playing on a US Open style course again. Sack the rangers
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Post by AFCTUJacko on Nov 19, 2019 6:12:30 GMT -5
And it's all because "realistic" scoring is valued over providing a semi realistic round of golf. The outcome (nobody, even the flickers, will break -50. NOONE!) is being prioritised over the experience of the rest of the field. All in my humble opinion. Please do tell me i'm wrong & why.... The realistic scoring argument - I'm not sure where that originated from - maybe it was a few seasons ago, but I can say that I have not mentioned realistic scoring to our schedulers as a TGCT goal for as long as I can remember. It's not a goal - it's not even possible so there's no point in trying to push for it.
What I do ask for is a challenge for the best players in the game. Sometimes those challenges can push the boundaries for what people deem fair but for the most part it straddles the line just fine. That being said, I'm all for variety and know that when all is said and done you'll have that by the end of the season.
I don't think the last course was too difficult but since it was more fantasy it gets lumped into the unhappy streak of courses for some people. So the variety is there w/ regards to difficulty - but it's also there in regards to course type (realistic/fantasy) and with so many different possible combinations - it's possible to run into a streak of courses that just don't light your fire so the end result is negative feedback.
People that are fine with the setups generally don't post those thoughts as much as those unhappy, so you'll generally read the negative ones more often here.
Guess the long and short of it is - I don't push for realistic scoring and don't expect it from our schedulers on any tour. I've said that before, but it always pops up that our philosophy is realistic scoring (as much as possible in this game) so to newer members that may not have caught it the last time I said it, they can hear it from me directly.
Don’t want to get bogged down in the scoring thing – it was a secondary point and I take you at your word that it’s not something you try to do. But I think it happens naturally. Designers stating “I want to provide a challenge” is “I don’t want people to make too many birdies” in a slightly different language. But happy to park that. I’m less interested in the numbers and more interested in how they are arrived at. The word “challenge” is interesting. The only thing that got challenged this week is the ability to hit a 3 yard patch of green on approach. If you didn’t have that ability, on the vast majority of holes there was no alternative route to a birdie through a safe shot and a longer putt. You either got it right or you missed the green. Weeks 13/14 are the same in places. If they are set up Very Firm/Very Fast it will be do or die – perfect execution of the approach or you’re off the green. On some holes you can’t hold the green even if you execute a perfect approach. My beef isn’t that it’s unfair or too hard. It’s that it’s boring and resembles Golf less and less as time goes on. Is it just the way it’s gone design wise? Are the vast majority of the courses being produced either total fantasy (Week 10) or realistic looking with the table top, helter skelter greens (Week 11) bolted on to defend them? Accept it's quite possible I’d be moaning either way, but just don't see the variety. I see two things on rotation.
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Post by donkeypuncherben on Nov 19, 2019 6:20:46 GMT -5
I really think there should be a difference in result between missing an approach shot by 15 feet and missing one by 15 yards, this difference is often missing in the designs that put pins on ridges or table tops. To me, a good course should only have a few holes where you really need a perfect shot to be rewarded.
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Post by AFCTUJacko on Nov 19, 2019 6:26:47 GMT -5
I really think there should be a difference in result between missing an approach shot by 15 feet and missing one by 15 yards, this difference is often missing in the designs that put pins on ridges or table tops. To me, a good course should only have a few holes where you really need a perfect shot to be rewarded.
I spend 20 minutes typing a wall of text and someone comes along and sums it up in 3 lines....
But this is what I mean when I say in the back of designers minds it MIGHT be about scoring. Holes like that are designed so that as few people make a birdie as possible.
Let's say 33% of people execute the approach perfectly & make the birdie, & the remaining 67% don't and make a par or worse.
For me it would be a better hole if 50% of people made a birdie in total, but half of them did it by executing a perfect approach and the other half hit it to the fat bit of the green and made a 25 footer.
Feels to me like just because perfect approach shots are easier than they should be, we're being asked to produce them all the time to make a score.
The best courses give you options, they don't prescribe the shot you need to hit and punish you severely for not getting it quite right.
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Post by lessangster on Nov 19, 2019 14:15:28 GMT -5
I’m not a PGA player probably never will be, my opinion the game doesn’t give you enough backspin even with the master clubs to be playing target golf on a course with firm fast greens. I to hate forced layups on long par 4’s leaving you a longer shot into a green than your drive carried. I also hate the upturned saucer style greens that a lot of designers seem to use so if you don’t quite hit your target spot you either end up rolling of the back of the green or the front and sides.
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Post by GW_Hope on Nov 19, 2019 14:20:27 GMT -5
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Post by donkeypuncherben on Nov 20, 2019 10:48:29 GMT -5
I'm sure half the tour will hate most of my list. Out of the courses I played last season, here are the 10 I liked best Magnolia National Monterey Bay Country Club The Davies at Bora Bora (PGA) Kapalua Plantation Course PGA National TPC Summerlin Olympus Grand The California Tour Club The Buck Club Ladue C.C. (Tourney Ed.) I am also fine with Pebble, Scottsdale and other RCR's falling in their usual spots
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Post by rob4590 on Nov 20, 2019 11:14:05 GMT -5
I'm sure half the tour will hate most of my list. Out of the courses I played last season, here are the 10 I liked best Magnolia National Monterey Bay Country Club The Davies at Bora Bora (PGA) Kapalua Plantation Course PGA National TPC Summerlin Olympus Grand The California Tour Club The Buck Club Ladue C.C. (Tourney Ed.) I am also fine with Pebble, Scottsdale and other RCR's falling in their usual spots
You'll enjoy TST next week then Ben
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