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Post by Terry Grayson on Jan 27, 2019 21:22:39 GMT -5
Just played pin four on the "Tour" track
one word for you Job and Dario "DIABOLICAL" and i mean that is the most complimentary way possible
WOW.... Love every inch of this course... I had three birdies on the front 9 but not one of them were from putting.. All three were chips from off the green
I came into 9 with a shortish birdy putt, missed and then missed like a four footer for par.. did the same thing on 10 almost exactly for another bogie
I played 11-18 all with pars and ended up -1 ... I loved every shot of that -1 also
Probably the most real looking course I have played in either iteration of this game and that #10 may be my all time favorite look from the tee...
OUTSTANDING!!!! Off to try and tame this pin 4 set again soon! ha ha
Terry
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Post by hippystein on Jan 29, 2019 3:26:43 GMT -5
Firstly the course looks really good and plays tough. Love the sculpting of the surrounds and the bunkering. Loads of positives but massively tricked up. I enjoyed the test when i first played it but when you get all four rounds you soon come to notice that all pin positions are either 3 boxes from the front edge or the back edges with all sculpting on greens aimed to divert the ball away from the pins so even a great approach shot can get penalised making approaches all wind dependant. Playabilty is a must for me and this course is lacking that due to pin placement. I love the green speeds and the test of them and how the approaches look. For example I had 106 to one par 4 when the pin was 3 boxes on so zoomed in and as all the holes the green slopes away from you in the landing area so i lofted up and hit it great. The ball bounced a couple of inches on the green and checked up and just missed the hole by a inch on the high side and looked to be coming to rest 6 inches behind the flag. But NO! It kept going and ended up 34ft away pin high with a 19 inch putt uphill. There were numerous times i hit really great approaches and just got shafted with the ball rolling into a dip with a 1/10 chance of making the putt due to having to hit the putt up onto yellow or red to even have a chance of getting the line. I also noticed youve set the bunkers as soft so when the ball lands in them 90% of the time you end up with a poached egg. I genuinely love the layout and the sculpting is great but when rangered i wouldnt be surprised if you asked to move alot of the pins slightly. It doesnt have to be much but you havent given a bail out option on 95% of the shots. Every approach makes you take on the flag as anywhere else on the green is dead. In my opinion itd be a great matchplay course though as it is very risk reward on every hole. Long and short of it. I really think this could be one of the best courses on the game if it is tweaked slightly. I enjoy the test of a great tough course but think the pin sets need more variation. Youve made big greens but by putting all the flags 2-3 boxes from the front edges bored me in the end.
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Post by jwfickett on Jan 29, 2019 6:45:59 GMT -5
Would recommend you try the members version, as described in earlier posts. Thanks for your play.
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Post by csugolfer60 on Jan 29, 2019 7:19:23 GMT -5
Firstly the course looks really good and plays tough. Love the sculpting of the surrounds and the bunkering. Loads of positives but massively tricked up. I enjoyed the test when i first played it but when you get all four rounds you soon come to notice that all pin positions are either 3 boxes from the front edge or the back edges with all sculpting on greens aimed to divert the ball away from the pins so even a great approach shot can get penalised making approaches all wind dependant. Playabilty is a must for me and this course is lacking that due to pin placement. I love the green speeds and the test of them and how the approaches look. For example I had 106 to one par 4 when the pin was 3 boxes on so zoomed in and as all the holes the green slopes away from you in the landing area so i lofted up and hit it great. The ball bounced a couple of inches on the green and checked up and just missed the hole by a inch on the high side and looked to be coming to rest 6 inches behind the flag. But NO! It kept going and ended up 34ft away pin high with a 19 inch putt uphill. There were numerous times i hit really great approaches and just got shafted with the ball rolling into a dip with a 1/10 chance of making the putt due to having to hit the putt up onto yellow or red to even have a chance of getting the line. I also noticed youve set the bunkers as soft so when the ball lands in them 90% of the time you end up with a poached egg. I genuinely love the layout and the sculpting is great but when rangered i wouldnt be surprised if you asked to move alot of the pins slightly. It doesnt have to be much but you havent given a bail out option on 95% of the shots. Every approach makes you take on the flag as anywhere else on the green is dead. In my opinion itd be a great matchplay course though as it is very risk reward on every hole. Long and short of it. I really think this could be one of the best courses on the game if it is tweaked slightly. I enjoy the test of a great tough course but think the pin sets need more variation. Youve made big greens but by putting all the flags 2-3 boxes from the front edges bored me in the end. [br I would suggest going back and giving it another go with a little more thought into where you are hitting approach shots. The bunkers are set to firm, most holes do not slope away from you coming into the approach. There are also no holes that a ball almost comes to rest 6 inches from the hole and rolls to 35 feet. And for bailouts, there is always a section of green 15-25 feet from the hole that is open for approaches to the fat side. Sorry if I come across as brash, but there seems to be an epidemic of players who want to pitch and putt their way to a 56 each round, and while you may get it from many of the weekly courses on the TGCTours schedule, you’ll definitely never get that from a course of mine and Job’s. Thanks for the playthrough!
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Post by hippystein on Jan 29, 2019 7:45:28 GMT -5
Ill play it again later, the greens do slope away on alot of the pins on the front edges of the greens in the ideal landing area causing all the spin to be taken off so impossible to stop the ball close. Id like to think i know wat im talking about when im playing this game. Im sure the reteric for pin placement for the tour is at least 3 boxes from the edge thats all and there are a number of pins that arent. I wish id of saved the clip where it ran down the hill now. Ill play the same pin set and see if i can replicate but it did happen. You have sculpted the ideal landing areas to play funky.that doubled up with normal fairways if you do pitch it 1ft short it stays short Me and all the lads i play with were in agreement with that. The reachable par 5 on the bk 9 on pinset four the pin is 8ft on i had 229 banged a couple of taps of loft on the 5 wd and sweeted it. Its close real close and it pitched on the fringe and instead of releasing onto the green it came backwards and nearly went wet but if id of hit it normal it would of hit the green and because the greens are firm it would of gone long and the backstop would of been ineffective leaving me with a dirty putt that you'd struggle to keep on the green. Like i said i love the course and i love a good test but theres a good test thats fair and one thats specifically been tricked up. Its a great test and ive shot -9 on it so far and thats leaving a few out there.
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Post by csugolfer60 on Jan 29, 2019 8:13:10 GMT -5
Ill play it again later, the greens do slope away on alot of the pins on the front edges of the greens in the ideal landing area causing all the spin to be taken off so impossible to stop the ball close. Id like to think i know wat im talking about when im playing this game. Im sure the reteric for pin placement for the tour is at least 3 boxes from the edge thats all and there are a number of pins that arent. I wish id of saved the clip where it ran down the hill now. Ill play the same pin set and see if i can replicate but it did happen. You have sculpted the ideal landing areas to play funky.that doubled up with normal fairways if you do pitch it 1ft short it stays short Me and all the lads i play with were in agreement with that. The reachable par 5 on the bk 9 on pinset four the pin is 8ft on i had 229 banged a couple of taps of loft on the 5 wd and sweeted it. Its close real close and it pitched on the fringe and instead of releasing onto the green it came backwards and nearly went wet but if id of hit it normal it would of hit the green and because the greens are firm it would of gone long and the backstop would of been ineffective leaving me with a dirty putt that you'd struggle to keep on the green. Like i said i love the course and i love a good test but theres a good test thats fair and one thats specifically been tricked up. Its a great test and ive shot -9 on it so far and thats leaving a few out there. The ideal landing areas are not where you are landing the ball, would be my guess. Away from the pin. However, you are correct that trying to take shots directly at the pin and stop it close will definitely play funky and be impossible much of the time, by design. If you try to stop the ball a few feet away you will usually end up much worse that if you play away from the pin by about 15 or 20 feet.
If your personal best so far is -9, while leaving some out there, the course is definitely not "tricked up". By most definitions, being able to birdie at least half the holes and miss some chances means the course is playing relatively easy. Also, the low out there on PC is -13, so unrealistically low scores are out there as well. I haven't checked PS4 or Xbox leaderboards yet, but I would assume there are some around there as well.
Thanks again for the playthrough! All feedback is appreciated, so we can make our next course even harder
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Post by csugolfer60 on Jan 29, 2019 8:14:05 GMT -5
Just played pin four on the "Tour" track one word for you Job and Dario "DIABOLICAL" and i mean that is the most complimentary way possible WOW.... Love every inch of this course... I had three birdies on the front 9 but not one of them were from putting.. All three were chips from off the green I came into 9 with a shortish birdy putt, missed and then missed like a four footer for par.. did the same thing on 10 almost exactly for another bogie I played 11-18 all with pars and ended up -1 ... I loved every shot of that -1 also Probably the most real looking course I have played in either iteration of this game and that #10 may be my all time favorite look from the tee... OUTSTANDING!!!! Off to try and tame this pin 4 set again soon! ha ha Terry Terry, I really appreciate your playthroughs and feedback on this track. We really enjoyed watching you guys play through it on the Goat Ranch playthrough!
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Post by hippystein on Jan 29, 2019 8:51:55 GMT -5
I played it with no wind meter on all the defaults but ill give it another go. I always look for the best way to the hole so i dont quite get your playing away theory. Dont get to no2 in world by just smashing at pins 😀.
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Post by inflames47 on Jan 29, 2019 12:43:37 GMT -5
Fantastic course loved the challenge!
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Post by coruler2 on Jan 29, 2019 18:43:40 GMT -5
Just played pin four on the "Tour" track one word for you Job and Dario "DIABOLICAL" and i mean that is the most complimentary way possible WOW.... Love every inch of this course... I had three birdies on the front 9 but not one of them were from putting.. All three were chips from off the green I came into 9 with a shortish birdy putt, missed and then missed like a four footer for par.. did the same thing on 10 almost exactly for another bogie I played 11-18 all with pars and ended up -1 ... I loved every shot of that -1 also Probably the most real looking course I have played in either iteration of this game and that #10 may be my all time favorite look from the tee... OUTSTANDING!!!! Off to try and tame this pin 4 set again soon! ha ha Terry This is actually the one thing I don’t personally care for...the ‘play for chips’ style of greens and difficulty. I would rather reward GIRs and punish missed greens, but with pins right on edges, you best shot in this video game to get close is to miss just off the green so the ball stops giving an easier 10ft chip over a 35ft putt with wicked slope from the middle of the green.
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Post by csugolfer60 on Jan 29, 2019 19:29:17 GMT -5
Just played pin four on the "Tour" track one word for you Job and Dario "DIABOLICAL" and i mean that is the most complimentary way possible WOW.... Love every inch of this course... I had three birdies on the front 9 but not one of them were from putting.. All three were chips from off the green I came into 9 with a shortish birdy putt, missed and then missed like a four footer for par.. did the same thing on 10 almost exactly for another bogie I played 11-18 all with pars and ended up -1 ... I loved every shot of that -1 also Probably the most real looking course I have played in either iteration of this game and that #10 may be my all time favorite look from the tee... OUTSTANDING!!!! Off to try and tame this pin 4 set again soon! ha ha Terry This is actually the one thing I don’t personally care for...the ‘play for chips’ style of greens and difficulty. I would rather reward GIRs and punish missed greens, but with pins right on edges, you best shot in this video game to get close is to miss just off the green so the ball stops giving an easier 10ft chip over a 35ft putt with wicked slope from the middle of the green. Completely agree - I tried to make as many pins as possible slope away from the edge near it and not make the edge accessible so this could be avoided. I considered widening fringe and fairway near the hole, but unfortunately that just widened the landing area too, so decided against it. Just one of those things that’s hard to avoid in the game.
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Post by gheebuttersnaps on Jan 29, 2019 19:59:42 GMT -5
You guys did an incredible job on this course. I hope you team up for more projects because I think this is a match made in heaven.
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adx321
Weekend Golfer
Posts: 101
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Post by adx321 on Feb 1, 2019 0:03:28 GMT -5
Ill play it again later, the greens do slope away on alot of the pins on the front edges of the greens in the ideal landing area causing all the spin to be taken off so impossible to stop the ball close. Id like to think i know wat im talking about when im playing this game. Im sure the reteric for pin placement for the tour is at least 3 boxes from the edge thats all and there are a number of pins that arent. I wish id of saved the clip where it ran down the hill now. Ill play the same pin set and see if i can replicate but it did happen. You have sculpted the ideal landing areas to play funky.that doubled up with normal fairways if you do pitch it 1ft short it stays short Me and all the lads i play with were in agreement with that. The reachable par 5 on the bk 9 on pinset four the pin is 8ft on i had 229 banged a couple of taps of loft on the 5 wd and sweeted it. Its close real close and it pitched on the fringe and instead of releasing onto the green it came backwards and nearly went wet but if id of hit it normal it would of hit the green and because the greens are firm it would of gone long and the backstop would of been ineffective leaving me with a dirty putt that you'd struggle to keep on the green. Like i said i love the course and i love a good test but theres a good test thats fair and one thats specifically been tricked up. Its a great test and ive shot -9 on it so far and thats leaving a few out there. The ideal landing areas are not where you are landing the ball, would be my guess. Away from the pin. However, you are correct that trying to take shots directly at the pin and stop it close will definitely play funky and be impossible much of the time, by design. If you try to stop the ball a few feet away you will usually end up much worse that if you play away from the pin by about 15 or 20 feet.
If your personal best so far is -9, while leaving some out there, the course is definitely not "tricked up". By most definitions, being able to birdie at least half the holes and miss some chances means the course is playing relatively easy. Also, the low out there on PC is -13, so unrealistically low scores are out there as well. I haven't checked PS4 or Xbox leaderboards yet, but I would assume there are some around there as well.
Thanks again for the playthrough! All feedback is appreciated, so we can make our next course even harder You know I dig your work but what kind of logic is "if you try to hit it close, that's dumb, hit it farther away" good shots should be rewarded, not punished. I like this course as I do all of you and fickett's work but just disagree that hole locations have to be right next to false fronts etc. My favorite course of yours is still Crawford but the green on #6 was just bogus on the falose front and up hole location and I think you have an addiction to those types of setups I don't think it's a designers job to police scores and if it is it can't be just due to funky hole locations or green setups. Courses are ALWAYS going to get wrecked. Trying to add treachory to every hole location is just fake defense in my opinion. Again, you are the man and I'm 1% the designer you are, but we just disagree on hole location logic
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Post by csugolfer60 on Feb 1, 2019 9:01:07 GMT -5
The ideal landing areas are not where you are landing the ball, would be my guess. Away from the pin. However, you are correct that trying to take shots directly at the pin and stop it close will definitely play funky and be impossible much of the time, by design. If you try to stop the ball a few feet away you will usually end up much worse that if you play away from the pin by about 15 or 20 feet.
If your personal best so far is -9, while leaving some out there, the course is definitely not "tricked up". By most definitions, being able to birdie at least half the holes and miss some chances means the course is playing relatively easy. Also, the low out there on PC is -13, so unrealistically low scores are out there as well. I haven't checked PS4 or Xbox leaderboards yet, but I would assume there are some around there as well.
Thanks again for the playthrough! All feedback is appreciated, so we can make our next course even harder You know I dig your work but what kind of logic is "if you try to hit it close, that's dumb, hit it farther away" good shots should be rewarded, not punished. I like this course as I do all of you and fickett's work but just disagree that hole locations have to be right next to false fronts etc. My favorite course of yours is still Crawford but the green on #6 was just bogus on the falose front and up hole location and I think you have an addiction to those types of setups I don't think it's a designers job to police scores and if it is it can't be just due to funky hole locations or green setups. Courses are ALWAYS going to get wrecked. Trying to add treachory to every hole location is just fake defense in my opinion. Again, you are the man and I'm 1% the designer you are, but we just disagree on hole location logic
I agree with the sentiment that funky greens are kind of wacky, but I have several things to say about this -
1.) The 6th at Crawford mines is not a good green.
2.) The logic is not "if you try to hit it close, that's dumb, hit it farther away", but rather "if you try to hit it close, you will probably end up worse than if you try to play away from the pin to the fat of the green." There is usually a chance of hitting it within a few feet on all the pins at Conservatory, but even if you execute a perfect mechanical shot, you'll still not get close if you try to take on the short side of every pin. There is luck and uncertainty involved in taking on most pins, and if you're not willing to take the risk, you should play to the center of the green. Those who do will always have a make-able putt for birdie, assuming they execute the safe shot well.
3.) Courses are not always going to be wrecked, but there is a culture that says that anytime anyone finds a course frustrating (meaning they can't birdie 12 holes a round), it must be a problem with the course. So we don't see courses that actually challenge players on these tours with any other skill besides executing a perfectly straight Fast-Fast shot that judges the wind. Strategy is pretty much non-existent.
4.) Every hole location should have treachery, but not in the same way. There should always be something to punish a player who doesn't think, and to reward a player who takes the time to think about where the best chance of getting a birdie putt is from.
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wmr5277
Amateur Golfer
Posts: 226
TGCT Name: Vitaly Potapenko
Tour: PGA
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Post by wmr5277 on Feb 1, 2019 12:22:09 GMT -5
Flat out loved this course. 5 stars. Hope this gets used on pga tour tgctours as a major.
After a couple rage quits after a few holes due to disasterous tempo...finally had decent tempo the next go around.
Played on default everything. Winds were probably 8 to 13 mph all round I reckon.
Played "Tour" version from tips on pin 4 and was -7.
Unbelievably fair course as I was bogey free, with 14/14 fairways and 1 missed GIR...and missed a straight in 10 footer on 16.
Absolutely loved how all pins were near edges. There's only 2 ways in my opinion where you can create a course to register -7 as a good score...
On a lesser extent you do very fast/very firm everything and create a course that is 8000+ yards...
But on planet earth; you either 1. Have very high winds. Which most don't seem to enjoy...
Or 2. Have pins close to the edge. You put pins anywhere near the center of the green...and hand a great player in the community a 150-200 yard shot in the fairway and they are usually walking away with a birdie.
Many times I had wedge in and I'm like "wow, I need to hit a great shot here to hit it inside 8 feet" (which as we know 99% of the time isn't the case)...
And I thought a lot of times avenues were provided to aim wide of target and feed it to target...most notably 3 wood off #9 tee...aimed it way left to back right pin and funneled to about 9 foot for a semi-easy birdie putt.
There was only 1 pin that I thought "tetered on the line" of fair...and that was front pin on 13 I believe.
Hit it pin high 8 feet right and had to lag my birdie putt or I would have gone off green. But I can understand the "can't go pin high on that pin" argument at the same time.
Anyways...great course guys!
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